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Santorum’s billionaire supporter Foster Friess on contraception:
Back in my day, they used Bayer aspirin for contraceptives. The gals put it between their knees and it wasn’t that costly.
No, this was contraception back in your day:
Condom wrapper, Texas, 1910.
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He’s telling a very old joke, in case anyone’s wondering–by holding the asprin between your knees, you make sexual penetration impossible. :(
Thank you. I’ve seen this all over the internet, and try as I might to think like a misogynist wingnut I couldn’t make a damn bit of sense out of it.
Me neither. At first I thought he was advocating some sort of knee sex.
It is pretty easy if you are of a certain age (as I am), since it was common in my youth.
except of course you dont (yes, we tried it as a joke)
It doesn’t surprise me that a conservative talking point would demonstrate and ignorance of the actual physical mechanics of sex.
Doggy-style is beyond their imaginations… Other than that, it works fine.
‘Keeping one’s legs together’ is surely not yet a completely dead cultural trope?
Most enjoyable way to refute a wingnut ever.
The question is, does he know it was a joke originally? There’s a shocking lack of understanding of basic literary devices — irony, metonymy, even simple things like sarcasm and analogy — in some political circles, leading to unfortunate incidents like Onion articles being cited as fact, etc.
It’s interesting that Republicans tend to treat The Onion and The Bible in the same manner.
And Bayer is still a viable brand in the US what with them being part of IG Farben who helped bring the world that other well known right-wing contraceptive Zyklon B?
THANKS! I was trying to figure out all yesterday what the conext of that joke was..not very funny!..I think the joke he made at the about romney at the CPAC convention was a lot better..lol
So, it’s not this?
(Just kidding–I’m easily old enough to remember that “joke.”)
Yeah, that might not be ‘impossible,’ actually.
Not pictured: The onion tied to Mr. Friess’s belt.
Ahh… Gotta love the era of billionaires and their pet politicians.
Don’t just read the transcript, watch the video.
The unflappable Mrs. Alan Greenspan’s reaction is priceless.
No … it would be priceless if she had a pulse, and some sense of outrage. Or maybe if she hadn’t immediately changed the topic.
A billionaire asshole just went on her show and said contraception was society pandering to the demands of shameless hussies, and she distinguished herself by blinking a bit?
I just found her obvious befuddlement funny. Those seconds of dead air and the fumbling “Ah…uh…um..,” from someone who, as you note, doesn’t normally have a pulse.
It was like a scene from Punk’d.
Reminded me of one of those early Ali G episodes.
I almost feel sorry for Little Ricky.
Also, did he say “terrorist camps in Latin America?”
I heard “jihadist camps in Latin America.”
Mrs. G is asking her tweeps what could she have said, what should she have said, describing herself as speechless.
Currently, girls crossing their legs is hyped as an effective birth control and rape prevention technique. It will come as no surprise that it doesn’t work either.
I think a more effective method might be the one promoted to quit smoking some years back by putting a rubber band around the wrist then snapping it when the urge struck. Boys could put a rubber band on their penis and snap it whenever the urge to knock that asprin out of the way struck them.
I have to admit that I approve of men like this showing us exactly what sort of person they are by flunking decent human being 101 in front of a national audience.
yeah I’m thinking this guy has an excellent contraceptive, his personality.
I often cite the Florence King bon mot, “If I could only put a paper bag over his personality.”
We learn an interesting fact about a conservative at least once a day. This one is that women need to uncross their legs to have sex.
I would say that he has an extremely boring sex life but I have no idea how many wetsuits he owns.
Actually, this was the most common method of birth control in my youth in the 1960s.
I would have guessed cola douche
Cola douche perhaps, but always lots of prayer.
You are mistaken. Lysol was the caustic solution sold as a feminine hygiene product.
Cola was pretty popular in Oklahoma in the 1960s. Can’t say about Lysol.
In what sex, exactly, is free contraception a “right”?
Er, in what sense. Heh.
Do try a response that doesn’t involve ad hominem.
There is a mistaken belief among many that ad hominem arguments are invalid. There are situations in which they are acceptable.
When arguing with someone who is dishonest or insane, it is valid to counter assertions with accusations of dishonesty or insanity.
When arguing with someone who is demonstrably lacking the intellectual capacity or training to understand the facts and logic in question, it is acceptable to point that out.
It has been my experience that people who try to innoculate an argument against ad hominem methods are those who have been subject to them justifiably.
In the “under the law people get free preventive care, and women are people, too” sex.
So pregnancy is a disease that strikes its victims at random?
Yes.
Really? Gee, I was always taught that babies come from sex. You mean you can catch airborne pregnancy? Wow, maybe contraceptives are needed after all in that case.
Just so we’re clear, are you arguing that unless a condition’s mode of transmission is airborne, it’s not a disease?
Oh goody! Can we give this asshat a nice does of cholera and have his insurance company deny treatment?
Yes, that be the “preventative” part. Whether the thing goes safely or not, you’ve shortened your lifespan and pretty much ruined your bone density, and those are the things I can remember off the top of my head.
So why aren’t we carrying out mandatory sterilizations before anymore women ruin their lives by getting pregnant?
Especially since it’s apparently an airborne illness now.
Uh, for the same reason we don’t mandate medical care for anyone? I realize conservatives don’t really understand the concept of ‘consent’ but it’s a pretty important part of our medical system.
A totalitarian state where the government decides that you, RedStater57, should be sterilized against your will is bad for all involved.
Also, and this might be most shocking to you, so brace yourself, women are quite capable of assessing risks/benefits and making their own medical decisions.
Right. If you think the state needs to be involved in personal decisions such as whether to use or buy contraception, please feel free to emigrate to a totalitarian state.
We appear to have suddenly shifted from ‘access to health care as a right’ to ‘mandatory health related procedures’.
Is there some explanation for this sudden change?
Conservatives don’t have any understanding of the concept of consent. We learned this in the torture debate, where it was OK to subject prisoners to water torture against their will because we do the same thing to Special Forces trainees with their enthusiastic consent.
I thought we learned it in the FISA debate, where it was OK to wiretap phones because people talk loudly about their personal lives on their cell phones.
I have this conversation with people all the time with regard to gardening. The definition of disease is not what you think it is.
dis·ease
[dih-zeez] Show IPA noun, verb, -eased, -eas·ing.
noun
1.
a disordered or incorrectly functioning organ, part, structure, or system of the body resulting from the effect of genetic or developmental errors, infection, poisons, nutritional deficiency or imbalance, toxicity, or unfavorable environmental factors; illness; sickness; ailment.
2.
any abnormal condition in a plant that interferes with its vital physiological processes, caused by pathogenic microorganisms, parasites, unfavorable environmental, genetic, or nutritional factors, etc.
3.
any harmful, depraved, or morbid condition, as of the mind or society: His fascination with executions is a disease.
4.
decomposition of a material under special circumstances: tin disease.
So when a woman gets pregnant, its because her body is functioning incorrectly? You’re saying infertility is natural and fertility is a disease to be treated? Right?
All diseases are natural. Cancer is a natural part of life, germs are a natural part of life, broken bones is a natural part of life, and so on. The point is that diseases are parts of nature which we don’t want, and unwanted pregnancy certainly fits into that category.
If a person doesn’t want to be pregnant, then yes, her body is acting incorrectly by becoming pregnant.
All conditions, states, and diseases are natural, but if you’re looking at what’s harmful or helpful, pregnancy definitely has harmful effects. That some women consider the child they get out of it to be worth the harmful effects of pregnancy doesn’t mean pregnancy should be mandatory for women who don’t.
You’re saying infertility is natural and fertility is a disease to be treated? Right?
RedStater,
You are correct in pointing out that pregnancy is not a disease and birth control is not a cure for any disease.
That being said, you’re being sucked into the frame the liberals would like this to be and that is about access to birth control. That is not the issue.
Birth control is freely accessable, extremely cheap. And if you’re really poor, Medicaid already covers it.
The real issue is the overreach of the federal government to force religious institutions to do things that are against their faith and against the first amendment of the constitution.
Yeah, these same people were all about the consitution and in particular the first amendment when discussing OWS, but now….not so much.
You are correct in pointing out that pregnancy is not a disease and birth control is not a cure for any disease.
No, he is incorrect.
If it can kill you it bloody well is a disease.
Let the women die is not at this time considered to be an appropriate remedy among decent human beings.
Extremely cheap? If it’s not covered by insurance at all it can cost about $100 per packet, about $1300 per year.
If it’s partially covered, that’s $50 per packet, or $650 per year.
If you’re lucky enough to be near a Planned Parenthood, you can get it priced on a sliding scale according to your income – about $30 per packet, $360 per year for a person making about $50,000. But Republicans are doing everything in their power to shut down Planned Parenthood, too.
I don’t know how much it costs, if anything, on Medicaid, but that’s another thing Republicans are trying to throw out.
So really, it’s prohibitively expensive in the worst case, pretty expensive in most cases, and only extremely cheap in a handful of cases (which Republicans are doing their best to prevent).
I suspect Boob prefers condoms, which probably run somewhere on the level of $15 for a two year supply for him.
$15 dollars would easily cover two lifetimes with plenty left over for Boob.
The Catholic Church has empirically demonstrated that paying for birth control for employees not directly employed in religious duties is not a violation of their tenets.
Oh, and you’ve said nothing about how it is a “right”, like the right to freedom of speech or religion.
Where is it in the Constitution? OTOH freedom of religion is mentioned in the Constitution. But nothing about free contraception (or healthcare at all).
I like to think of it as also “Freedom FROM Religion”.
You can believe X.
I can believe Y.
No one gets to think differently.
I like to think of it as also “Freedom FROM Religion”
Who gives a shit about that? That is not what the constitution states.
Read it sometime.
Bob’s understanding of the Constitution equals his understanding of women.
I would say that for his positions on contraception he doesn’t deserve to have sex, but I think we all know that ain’t happening anyway.
It’s calle d the “establishment clause, Bob.
Reading is FUNdamental.
Actually that is exactly what it says. More properly, what is says is there is a freedom from coerced religion. Neither you nor the Catholic bishops get to force their religion or its beliefs on anybody else.
You are free to believe and worship as you please, and this law does not force anyone to actually use contraception. It also exempts specifically religious institutions (churches and temples).
It is the non-religious institutions run by religious bodies (schools, hospitals, charities) which serve and employ people who are not members of the religion which are subject to it. Do try to get a fucking clue.
+1
Exactly right. Its my freedom to be able to ignore your religion. And Bob’s.
Actually that is exactly what it says. More properly, what is says is there is a freedom from coerced religion.
Let’s all take a deep breath and remember that the Bill of Rights, the first 10 amendments to the constitution passed all in one bill was to restrict the federal government’s power in dealing with it’s citizens.
And it begins with “Congress shall make no law….”
It simply restricts the federal government…that’s it. It doesn’t guarantee any “right” other than to restrict the government from getting involved by making laws restricting the free exercise of religion….and this is what this administration is attempting to do.
It simply restricts the federal government…that’s it.
In Boob’s world, if the Catholic Church decides to go back to burning heretics, “Congress shall make no law” to stop them.
Yea, that seems sane.
Uh–have you ever heard of the 14th Amendment?
And you are asking Congress to make a law that establishes religion by allowing them to impose their beliefs on everyone else. Because that is exactly that the “religious exemption” would do. Dumb shit.
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
I like to think the “Promote the General Welfare” comment as what the concept of Healthcare falls under.
Just as our Declaration included “Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness” – the “Life” part for me also means the concept of a HEALTHY nation.
The Air Force is not in the Constitution.
Can I have back the money that went from my taxes toward the F-22?
Neither is radio, or TV, or airlines, or trains, or national parks, or oil drilling, or cancer research or treatment, or submarines, or vaccines, or sattelites, or GPS spectrum, or arsenic in apple juice, or…
what a fun game playing at being libertarians can be….
What we have here is the Republican view of the Constitution, which has the government unlimited power except in instances where the Constitution explicitly restrains the government. You have only those rights expressly stated in the Constitution, because rights come from the government. None of this nonsense about “endowed by their creator,” or “inalienable rights.”
Oddly, of course, when it comes to issues they care about, the Republicans throw this constitutional theory in the trash immediately.
You’re not seeing the whole picture. There are people like me who use the pill to inhibit tumor growth. My other option is a hysterectomy, which would bring a host of ill side-effects. So for me – and many others – this is a vital healthcare issue.
Nice Freudian slip.
Well, sure, it’s OK for you to get it, but we must keep it out of the hands of the Bad Girls.
And if pregnancy is a disease we better get busy sterilizing people before this horrible illness strikes anyone ever again.
Criminy! Look it up in any one of the free online dictionaries.
This word, disease. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Yeah, none of those definitions cover pregnancy in any universe I’m aware of.
Maybe that’s because you’re unclear on the definition of “pregnancy”.
That would apply to pretty much everything from the available evidence.
If the maternal mortality rate had not just gone up in the US you might have a point, RedStater.
Since my kind die from pregnancy on a fairly regular basis it seems to me that even someone as dim as you might be able to comprehend that it qualifies as a disease.
OKAY!
So, on my list are residents of Kansas, the Carolinas, Florida, Arizona, Oaklahoma, Texas, West Virginia, the Dakotas,…
Registered Republicans of breeding age.
People who like EMO music.
People who watch Survivor or Criminal Minds.
I can keep going…
So you are volunteering? Great! We were all afraid of the possibility you might actually breed and continue your nonsense to another generation.
Glad you stepped up to the plate and are putting the raisins between your legs on the line for the sake of humanity.
We can only wish your mother had followed your advise before you were born. You and Dishonorable Boob are doing your best to make me rethink my opposition to eugenics.
And still nothing about “preventive care”, however defined, as a “right” to be paid for with other people’s money, even if its against their religious beliefs.
You may want to consider limiting your total number of comments somehow. 50 million comments all saying the same thing is a good way for me to consider deleting your comments.
He’s obviously a Norman sockpuppet. Isn’t that reason enough?
Insurance appears to be yet another word that this d00d has no idea what means.
What’s next? Women work for free because they shouldn’t be paid with other people’s money?
50 million comments all saying the same thing is a good way for me to consider deleting your comments.
Why not?
You’re only interested in diversity of race, not of religion or thought.
Yes.
Thanks.
Refreshingly honest.
Diversity kinds implies that the comments will vary somewhat. You know, like Velveeta slices are not particularly diverse.
You mean like the diversity of religion and thought of the people who use contraception?
Because you’re a threadjacker, and no one wants to take part in your weird public psychosexual displays.
If you’re serious, start here.
If you’re not, go away. Or at least be funny.
If you’re serious, start here.
Gee, Ben….what does any of that have to do with the rules that we have already decided as a culture to obey…the constitution?
Bob’s highly principled defense of the Constitution no doubt also includes his outrage at the evisceration of the 4th Amendment by the courts.
And the misreading of the second…
Actually, preventive care is an investment by society in it’s own economic and social well-being. People pay taxes for things they don’t individually support all the time: that’s why they call it “taxes” rather than “donations” or “mutual aid.” Many employers are forced to treat their workers better than they would if they had no legal obligations.
It’s the nature of modern society: fundamental rights are one thing; social norms and general welfare are something else entirely.
Any other dumb rhetoric you’d like corrected?
Let’s frame this in practical terms. You can pay a relatively low price for preventative care or you can pay many times that amount to treat the conditions when they visit the emergency room for treatment. Be clear on this, however, you will pay for it one way or the other and prevention is vastly cheaper.
You’re almost certainly erroneously assuming he understands how insurance works in the first place.
It’s trolls like you that make me miss Bloomie.
I still think Meade was the best troll of all. Good times, good times.
Given this crew, I miss The Donalde.
The Early Donalde, yes. The Donalde who could write at length about nihilism, without any fucking clue what it meant. But the Later Donalde, the one who had his schoolboy crush on Charli Carpenter dashed before him, the one who could write nothing beyond BWAHAHA, Winning!, fucker!, and anti-Semite – him not so much.
Late Donalde = Fat Elvis. Or, worse still, 1980s Rolling Stones. A sad, pitiful nostalgia act at best.
Yo Redstate, the issue of religious institutions having to comply with laws was already decided decades ago. Such as, back in the 19th century when the Feds forced Utah to comply with laws regarding polygamy if they wanted to become a state.
More recently, the decision in 1990 of Employment Div. vs. Smith: The Court held that the First Amendment’s protection of the “free exercise” of religion does not allow a person to use a religious motivation as a reason not to obey such generally applicable laws. “To permit this would be to make the professed doctrines of religious belief superior to the law of the land, and in effect to permit every citizen to become a law unto himself.” Thus, the Court had held that religious beliefs did not excuse people from complying with laws forbidding polygamy, child labor laws, Sunday closing laws, laws requiring citizens to register for Selective Service, and laws requiring the payment of Social Security taxes.
Also, as a woman, let me tell you ya moron – I am married and my husband & I are not interested in popping out a child every goddamn year until menopause. The same is true of most sane people (well, there is no accounting for nuts like the Duggars, but they are free to be morons in this country). And so yes, contraception is part of health care – just like prenatal checks, choosing a trained midwife or obstetrician to attend a birth. It’s part of living in a civilized country. Don’t like it? Move to Afghanistan, and have a lovely time, darlin’.
And oh, the above quote was taken from conservative darling, Justice Scalia.
blud duck,
An impassioned harangue, to be sure, but I think you’re off on a tangent here.
The issue at hand is not not about access or restricting access to these products. The issue is forcing others to pay for them against their long-held religious beliefs.
BC has been around for forever and is very inexpensive and widely available. Why you back this president’s rule (yes, he rules) that it be paid foforcibly covered by private insurers without co-pay when life saving cancer drugs require a co-pay is beyond me.
Welcome to CrazyTown
“BC has been around for forever and is very inexpensive and widely available”
No it fucking isn’t very inexpensive; it costs around $100/month you moron.
If forever means since Griswold made them stop putting people in jail for using it yeah, forever.
That’s the nature of a democratic society, Bob. The Quakers have to pay for bombing various brown people and the anti contraception nuts have to pay for other people’s birth control.
Birth control is much more widely used, thank the FSM, than cancer drugs, I’d assume that’s the reason.
Once the employer pays for the health insurance, it’s not the employer’s money any more; it’s the employee’s. By your reasoning, the Church could force its employees to not use their wages to buy birth control, because after all, the Church is paying for it.
‘blud duck’, heh, I like that. Cuz I am ’bout mad enough to spit blood at this point. Look, as Hogan pointed out below, the health insurance comes the individual employee’s $ to spend, not the Church’s (esp, since it does not come from church directly, but their business spinoffs, and by the by their businesses rake in a lot of $ from the federal gov’t).
Also, what a load of horseshit because in health, damn near anything can be caused of exacerbated by ‘lifestyle choice’ that some demented blue nose could argue over. Boner pills like viagra? SINFUL!
Had a heart attack and need a bypass? Well, too bad it is your fault ya had a heart attack – shouldn’t have eaten all those burgers and pizzas over the years huh. Seventh Day Adventists strongly encourage vegetarianism and they run hospitals where I live – think this attitude would fly? Doubt it.
Broke your leg in a skiing accident! No coverage for you – you knew you were taking a risk when you engaged in that superfluous activity.
No, these are unlikely to happen. Only when it is a health care issue that is perceived to affect primarily women is their objection. Hmm, funny that.
And as the Scalia quote pointed out, this ship has already goddamn sailed. The RC is not a law of the land unto themselves anymore than the 7th Day Adventists, Scientologists, LDS (tho’ they wish haha), or any other group of men wearing funny suits. Nope. Open a bidness? Gotta follow labor law. Big enough bidness? Health insurance? Don’t like it? Don’t open a business. Simple, ain’t it?
So if employers are allowed to force their religious beliefs on their employees, should a Jehovah’s Witness be allowed to force their employees on health insurance that won’t cover blood transfusions?
Not only that, a Christian Scientist should be allowed to provide health insurance that covers no medical procedures or prescription drugs of any kind.
And a Scientoligist should be able to provide health insurance that only covers E-Meter readings in place of psychiatric care and medication.
Hey, it saved this guy‘s life.
As I understand it, that is already true of the Christian Scientists. Remember, they own a rather successful newspaper, the Christian Science Monitor. I’ve heard they over different insurance programs to employees – each employee can either choose what we would think of as traditional coverage (MDs) or choose the CS practitioner coverage.
But under the rule the anti-woman Republicans want, they should be able to only offer the CS practitioner coverage to all employees, with no option for real medical coverage.
Ah, but as mendacious right-wing misogynist shit Sebastian Holsclaw pointed out at Crooked Timber, if we actually knew anything about Jehovah’s Witnesses besides the blood transfusion thing, we’d realize just how unlikely this scenario is. Apparently, their extreme “social separateness” doctrine means they can’t run businesses, or employ non-coreligionists, or whatever fabrication Holsclaw was implying to obfuscate matters. The point is, Quaker hospitals should be able to fire non-Quaker employees who join the National Guard, even if the hospitals receive the bulk of their funding from the public purse, because freedom.
Or better yet, prohibit them from voting.
While there is no direct right to preventive care, there is a right to equal protection under the law. In addition, there is a law granting access to preventive health care. The combination grants a right to preventive health care. You may not be made to suffer unequal treatment merely because you are employed by an organization run by the Catholic Church.
The question of religious freedom does not enter into the matter. The Catholic Church has empirically demonstrated that it does not consider the requirement to pay for the insurance which provides contraception for the employees in question to be a violation of their tenets.
As a pregnant lady (4 days past due!) I’d like to tell Redstater to go fuck himself. I’ve had a very easy pregnancy and hope for an uneventful birth. But even so there are major inconveniences, dangers, and discomforts. I was happy to take them on because I wanted to have a baby, and every time I faced something I thought I couldn’t handle I’d think “Remember why you’re doing this” and I got through it. I can’t imagine how awful even an easy pregnancy would be for an unwilling mother.
And before he foams at the mouth about my using his tax dollars with my slutty slutty uterus I’d like to inform him that I’m Canadian. OOGA BOOGA SOCIALIST MEDICINE!
(Seriously, the availability of healthcare and the social safety net were major reasons I decided to procreate. If I lived in the USA I would probably have put it off for another five years or so. So put that in your pro-life pipe and smoke it!)
4 days past due! Good luck!!!!
Could be worse. My younger sister was born more than a month past due.
And our daughter, two weeks. But we thought, at the time, that the doctor’s arithmetic was mistaken.
OOGA BOOGA SOCIALIST MEDICINE! FTW!
Godspeed future Mom!
Congratulations. Picked a pediatrician yet?
In Soviet Canada, pediatricians pick you!
Incontinentia Buttocks – I just have to know – are you a Sister of Indulgence? With that name, you should be!
[...] in days of yore, they used condoms. But aspirin will probably work. Or [...]
I was about to comment but then I took an aspirin to the knee.
That’s rough, former-adventurer.
skyrim fistbumb
If some pregnancies result in a dead baby, does that mean that pregnancy is a disease that affects babies, too?
It sounds like you are in a difficult situation, Stef. What Freudian slip are you referring to?
Redstate’s “In what sex …” HTH.
[...] in days of yore, they used condoms. But aspirin will probably work. Or [...]
Not to mention forbidding them to leave the house unguarded, forbidding them to see strange men within the house, etcetera.
Also: a great solution to the unemployment problem among men, once women can’t leave home (nor presumably tempt men with their brazen voices or emails by working from home).
Honor killings are another “traditional” institution that helps limit the need for contraception.
Not to mention forbidding them to leave buildings on fire.