Home / General / Tiger Beat on the Potomac fires Julia Ioffe for insufficient post-partisanship

Tiger Beat on the Potomac fires Julia Ioffe for insufficient post-partisanship

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Statement here.

Ioffe’s lese majeste (soon there will be laws) is here.

Seems like she was asking a perfectly fair question, though perhaps she should have phrased it more delicately, so as to not offend the delicate sensibilities of our new God-King and his easily triggered supporters.

 

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  • pianomover

    If those are my options then I think he’s fucking her.

    • Yankee

      I’d bet she cut him off when she was 13.

      • pianomover

        Yeech.

  • Hercules Mulligan

    The media won’t save you. Your employer won’t save you. The “good” billionaires in Silicon Valley won’t save you.

  • Lord Jesus Perm

    They fired someone who was leaving anyway. Petty. As. Fuck.

  • efgoldman

    “incidents like this tarnish POLITICO and the great work being done across the company.”

    You can’t tarnish shit.

    • DrDick

      But you can polish it.

      • Yankee

        … actually, one polishes the shoe. Been there, done that.

        • pianomover

          Is this about masturbation?

          • swkellogg

            What isn’t?

    • keta

      I think what most irked the pud-pullers at Politico is that Ioffe linked to The Hill in her tweet. How dare she!

    • XTPD

      They have Grunwald and Gold, and…Bill Scher contributes sometimes?

      Also, [haughty British voice] I prefer the term “Chestnut Knights of the Equine Order,” as I believe (having made it myself, THANK YOU VERY MUCH) it to be more precise in illustrating its particular brand of moral bankruptcy than the epithet coined by Mr. Charles P. Pierce, Esq. [/haughty British voice]

      • XTPD

        ETA: Couldn’t put the link in above response (fuck you, WordPress), but this phenomenon is the basic idea behind the nickname.

  • Linnaeus

    I eagerly await the condemnations of Politico‘s foray into political correctness.

    • Manju

      Well, they are running a muck.

  • XTPD

    This is about what you can expect from a publication that treats thinly-veiled misogyny as less unconscionable than accusing rich white guys of latent racism.

    OTOH: The Booktastic Busmobile does a partial mea culpa for its 2016 chickenfucking.

  • Nick056

    lol stop.

    “This dude is fucking his daughter” is a gross thing to tweet. Sure Trump is going to be terrible for the country, and sure he is grooming Ivanka to be President after him (duh!) but I’m not exactly shocked she got canned early for that.

    • Ronan

      It’s legitimate to question your presidents personal life if his behaviour is illegal/outside conventional norms.

      Eta: actually, I’ll leave this comment stand , but I do agree it’s a “gross thing to tweet”, if not a firable offence

      • Nick056

        It’s not really the “don’t insult the PEOTUS!” bit. That’s fair game. It’s the crudity of suggesting Trump’s daughter is having sex with him. Totally understand Politico finding it unacceptable.

        • Ronan

          I was only joking, by implying he probably was having sex with his daughter

        • ThrottleJockey

          You need to read more of PEOTUS’ comments about Ivanka. He’s made sexually crude comments about her more than once–on video. I think it’s more likely than not that he has molested her. A narcissist of such extremes certainly fits the type.

          • Nick056

            I’ve seen them. Thing is, the jokes about how, “If I acted like Trump, I’d get fired from my job!” are actually not jokes. They’re true. It’s sad and shameful, but Trump making bizarre “If she weren’t my daughter … ” comments about Ivanka doesn’t give Ioffe room to say that Ivanka fucked her way into the first lady’s suite. I mean, even writing that is disgusting.

            It’s not about CIVILITY!!!! it’s about decency and not being repulsive toward Ivanka.

            • XTPD

              A valid point, but in that context, this:

              sure he is grooming Ivanka to be President after him

              is a particularly poor bit of phrasing.

              ETA: Derp – socraticsilence said the same thing just downthread.

            • tsam

              Yeah–I wouldn’t put a statement like that on social media and I don’t even have anything to lose from it. Y’all motherfuckers need Jesus.

              • ThrottleJockey

                OMGZ I love this line!!! That’s the fucking line of the week!! No the year!!!!

                • tsam

                  I can’t take credit for it–it was in a movie, I think…I’ll see if I can find it.

                • tsam

                  Oh fucking awesome. I found a meme of Degrasse-Tyson saying “y’all motherfuckers need science “. MAX POWER APPROVES.

                • Craigo

                  Ha – Bad Boys II.

            • Captain Oblivious

              doesn’t give Ioffe room to say that Ivanka fucked her way into the first lady’s suite

              Learn to read. She didn’t say that.

              • Nick056

                Yeah … Key life tip. A woman gets something she wouldn’t get under normal circumstances (or which is seen as unexpected and prestigious). Someone says she’s sleeping with the person who gave it to her by way of explaining how she got it. That’s called an allegation of quid pro quo.

                • kvs

                  Or you could read it as the First Lady’s office usually goes to the First Lady, someone the President has presumably slept with.

                • Nick056

                  We’re really saying the same thing: the first lady sleeps with the president, so if Ivanka is the first lady, she sleeps with the president.

                • kvs

                  What you wrote implies judgment of the woman for pursuing a benefit she isn’t normally entitled to. Mine implies the president is in the wrong.

                • Nick056

                  We’re rapidly sledding down Ick Mountain here. Suffice to say that Ioffe’s tweet strongly suggests, to me, a joke about a father sleeping with his daughter and giving her a prominent position in his administration, which she accepts.

              • nixnutz

                No, she’s saying that he’s breaking the law by giving her a job. The incest part is a joke.

                Not that a reasonable person couldn’t, or shouldn’t, be offended by the joke, but to read it as her claiming that they’re actually having sex is dumb enough that I don’t believe you’re making the argument in good faith.

                • Nick056

                  Lord help us.

                  I didn’t “read it at as her claiming they’re actually having sex.” I read it as, well, what it is: a joke that they are sleeping together and she is serving as his First Lady in all ways. Gross, unsettling, fireable. But it’s also easy to interpret as a joking allegation of quid pro quo.

                  That said, not really sure nepotism laws apply here, because obviously there’s no law for him to “shirk” in this respect. And finally if you think it would be impossible for someone to seriously allege that incest occurred or is occurring, please, help yourself to this comment section.

                • cpinva

                  “Not that a reasonable person couldn’t, or shouldn’t, be offended by the joke, but to read it as her claiming that they’re actually having sex is dumb enough that I don’t believe you’re making the argument in good faith.”

                  all being said about a guy who flat out said how fuckable his daughter is, and that if she wasn’t his daughter, he’d try and fuck her. the only innocent party here is Ivanka who, regardless of the fact that she’s an adult, has still been dragged into the toxic waste site that is her father. she is a PhD candidate in psychology’s thesis topic on two legs. honestly, I won’t be at all shocked if this young woman has a nervous breakdown in the not too distant future.

                  with respect to Ms. Ioffe, she said what Trump himself has, at times, alluded to. If she was a guy, she’d be accused of misogyny, for having the nerve to say what’s already been said, by Trump himself. I doubt she’d have been summarily dismissed however. Of course, she was already leaving, so Tiger Beat’s flouncing has a bit less of an edge to it.

            • Cassiodorus

              Why? She’s as repulsive as her father.

          • efgoldman

            He’s made sexually crude comments about her more than once–on video.

            Of course he has not, no matter what the actual video and audio evidence shows.
            He never said HE SAW thousands of Muslims in Jersey City celebrating 9/11.
            He never said racist things.
            He always tells the truth.

            And I am the King of Siam.

            • XTPD

              Well, it still has a king.

              • efgoldman

                Well, it still has a king

                Long time since it’s been Siam, though.

                • XTPD

                  Doesn’t an angel get its wings ripped off every time someone fails to get a joke.

                • Colin Day

                  Replying to XTPD below

                  Doesn’t an angel get its wings ripped off every time someone fails to get a joke.

                  In other news, a guy named Clarence was found dead in Bedford Falls. The local coroner says he fell from a great height.

              • rea

                Somdet Phra Boromma-orasathirat Chao Fa Maha Vajiralongkorn Sayammakutratchakuman has only been king for a couple of months, though–he could be replaced, by someone whose name is easier to spell.

                • tsam

                  I wonder if they affectionately call him “eye chart” too.

    • socraticsilence

      There definitely appears to be some “grooming” Trump has done with his daughter.

    • leftwingfox

      So is “David Cameron put his penis in the mouth of a dead pig.

      It’s also true.

    • randy khan

      The actual tweet suggests there are two options, not that he necessarily is sleeping with his daughter. It’s not *that* different, though, and she certainly shouldn’t have said it.

      I don’t know if it would have been a firing offense if she weren’t already leaving, but if you’re Politico, and your business model is sucking up to important politicians, it’s a no-brainer

      • Manny Kant

        Come on. It was a rhetorical question, and it was obvious that the second option was the one Ioffe thought was going on.

    • JMP

      That would normally the case, but when we’re dealing with a President-elect who has openly talked about how much he wants to have sex with his daughter, so there is actually reason to suspect this might be true, so that speculation is in fact legitimate. It’s like speculating about Trump’s cocaine use, although there we’ve got so much evidence that it would actually be a complete shock to find out he’s not a coke-head.

      • rm

        Tangent, but since he abstains from alcohol, I wouldn’t be at all suprised if he abstains from other stuff. At least today. It’s hard to imagine being a New York celebrity in the ’80s without breathing it in as floating dust at parties. I think his narcissist brain supplies all the endorphins he needs to be a dry addict.

        • JMP

          He makes a very loud deal about how he doesn’t drink, and pointedly only mentions alcohol, which strikes me as a way of trying to cover for his use of harder stuff; plus there was his constant sniffling and very erratic behavior during the debates, which really seemed to indicate he had recently snorted up and was using cocaine as a performance-enhancer for them.

          • Captain Oblivious
            • cpinva

              damned if that guy isn’t Brent Spiner’s evil twin on Independence Day, Dr. “Skippy” Okun. I still think he’s an actor, hired by Trump to play the role of the skeezy “Dr.” who keeps Trump in the best of trim. Kind of a medical version of Paladin, “Have Prescription Pad, Will Travel”.

              • GeorgeBurnsWasRight

                In Trumpland, you don’t wire doctor, doctor wire you!

            • Hogan

              If you’re down he’ll pick you up
              Doctor Robert
              Take a drink from his special cup
              Doctor Robert

              Doctor Robert
              He’s a man you must believe
              Helping anyone in need
              No one can succeed like
              Doctor Robert

              Well, well, well, you’re feeling fine
              Well, well, well, he’ll make you
              Doctor Robert

    • Scott Lemieux

      Yes, it’s not as if Trump has photographed in creepy sexual contexts with his daughter multiple times, or talked openly about finding his daughter sexually attractive, or something like that. It was just a completely random insult.

      • UncleEbeneezer

        Or walked in on 15 year old models getting dressed or been accused of raping his ex-wife. Flouting sexual norms is kinda his thing so while the wording might have been better I have no problem with the joke, in general.

      • Nick056

        See my comment to TJ. It’s still gross to tweet what Ioffe did.

        • cpinva

          “It’s still gross to tweet what Ioffe did.”

          lots of truths are gross. if only the sweet things were ever published, very little would ever be published (kind of paraphrasing B. Franklin). I suppose her point could have been made more…………..delicately, but then, it probably wouldn’t have gotten nearly as much attention, now would it have?

          As I noted in an earlier post, the innocent party here is Ivanka. I feel certain she has never intentionally contributed to her own overt oversexualizing, or thought it was “cute”, “when Daddy would tell people he wanted to fuck me, when I was 15.” or 13, or 11, or whatever. I wonder who’s job it was, to keep him away from her, when she was younger?

      • ploeg

        If the claim is ultimately found to be true, it would be one of the least surprising scandals ever. It’s never enough to do it, you have to wink and smirk and drop innuendo.

        • elm

          Yep, this is crucial. If it turns out that Trump has ever acted on his stated impulses, then Ivanka is the victim of sexual abuse. Given the feminist nature of this blog and most of its commenters, we should realize how problematic joking about such things and, even worse, blaming the victim for them are.

          Ioffe has done a lot of good writing and I’m glad she’s leaving Politico for a better outlet like the Atlantic, but this tweet was a bad idea, and not just for the indelicate phrasing she apologized for. I don’t know if it’s a firable offense and she is certainly not irredeemable, but I’m surprised by how many people are not only defending the tweet but seem to be celebrating it.

          • Nick056

            I don’t know if it’s a firable offense and she is certainly not irredeemable, but I’m surprised by how many people are not only defending the tweet but seem to be celebrating it.

            Two comments:

            She may not be irredeemable, but she might need to spend five minutes in the penalty basket box.

            Plus: what’s playing out in this thread is people saying that sure Ioffe was politically incorrect but we all know it was a joke and we all know what she meant and why she said it. The only surprising thing to me is that Ctrl+f for “punching up” yields no results.

          • XTPD

            I’m pretty much in agreement that Ioffe’s tweet was, at the very least, fucking gross.

            That said, the Chestnut Knights still easily come off much worse, given that a) their pink slip goes far beyond what would’ve been sufficient in favor of burying its head up High Broderism’s ass; b) she was already leaving for The Atlantic, so their letter looks even more petty; and c) nobody with an IQ above single digits actually believes they give a shit about misogyny (note that, unlike Ioffe, Catanese still kept his job).

          • cpinva

            “Given the feminist nature of this blog and most of its commenters, we should realize how problematic joking about such things and, even worse, blaming the victim for them are”

            I haven’t noticed anyone on this blog doing either. no one is joking about it at all, and they sure as hell aren’t blaming the victim, for being victimized. I’m not alone in pointing out that she’s the innocent victim in all of this, having been dragged into the cesspool that is her father’s life.

    • Taters

      Crass? Perhaps, but I’ll take lèse-majesté for $200.Don’t shoot the messenger. I’m sure you’ve seen this, as well as all the otherdisgusting- at least to me- things Trump himself has said. Ioffe said “fuck”, trump has said “sexually attracted to…”. Let’s not hit our heads falling onto the fainting couch over the “f” word.

    • addicted44

      She is occupying the first lady’s office.

      Crudely put but pretty damn valid way to point out that Teump is nepotism defined.

      • Lurking Canadian

        The position of First Lady is already nepotism defined. Of all the things Trump has done, President To give Female Relative Quasi-official White House Role is pretty small beer.

    • Jim in Baltimore

      This should get you real good with the guards. Please remember the rest of us when we get to the work camp.

  • DrDick

    I have to admit I am a bit disturbed by that tweet. It is one thing to smack Trump for his pervy actions and statements. But directly implicating his daughter in the absence of any actual evidence seems to cross the line.

    • Ahenobarbus

      Yes. Even if you think he deserves it, his daughter doesn’t.

      • Ronan

        Well..why not ? She’s a grown woman, she’s implicated in his rise and will profit from his regime. Surely if he’s fair game on this then she is? (That’s not to say the tweet is fair game, but if it is for him whys it not for her?)

        • MilitantlyAardvark

          So, at what point do you draw the line, Ronan?

          I don’t have a high opinion of Ivanka myself, but in what world is it legitimate to suggest that the only reason she’s working with her father is because he has had sex with her?

          How would you have reacted if someone had said that the only reason Chelsea Clinton worked for her mother’s campaign was because she and Bill/Hill were sexual partners?

          • Ronan

            Well, as I said id probably draw a line at the tweet in question, for a number of reasons. But she’s not an innocent party in trumps rise ,so I don’t she her as an illigetimate target. (Ie the problems with the means used to attack them, not going after her)

          • ThrottleJockey

            Bill didn’t comment on Chelsea’s tits. He didn’t say he’d date her if only Chelsea wasn’t his daughter. He say of Chelsea “she’s a real piece of ass.” Trump’s own words damn him. Don’t mix up up Bill with Trump’s depraved shit.

            • Dilan Esper

              I remember Bill Clinton making creepy sexual comments to Alberto Fujimori about the 13 year old girl Peruvian mummy Juanita. It was a minor scandal in Peru.

              Bill Clinton was a pretty big sleazebag when it comes to sex. The only reason he gets a pass here is because of his politics.

              • cpinva

                “I remember Bill Clinton making creepy sexual comments to Alberto Fujimori about the 13 year old girl Peruvian mummy Juanita. It was a minor scandal in Peru.”

                please provide a cite for this. I’m not suggesting Bill is pure as the driven snow, but I’m having some difficulty imagining him making sexual comments about a mummy. as much as the media and republican pervs were all over him, about him being some kind of sexual hound dog, you’d think this would have gotten some play here in the US.

                ok, I found this:

                http://articles.latimes.com/1996-05-25/news/mn-8167_1_inca-mummy

                yeah, tacky joke, but mostly on himself. nowhere close to the comments Trump has made about living people, like his daughter.

                “Bill Clinton was a pretty big sleazebag when it comes to sex. The only reason he gets a pass here is because of his politics.”

                I could be wrong, but I do seem to recall him being impeached over sex, a blowjob, from someone not his wife, to be specific. he also supposedly raped every woman he ever met (along with HRC killing them all afterwards), grabbed their asses when he had a chance, grabbed other parts when opportunity presented itself. right. by comparison to Trump, Bill Clinton is nearly a monk.

                I also don’t recall Clinton getting a pass here, on his sexual peccadilloes, because of his politics.

              • JonH

                There’s nothing sexual about Clinton’s comments about the mummy.

            • MilitantlyAardvark

              Trump’s own words say that he has a thoroughly crass attitude to his daughter. They do not provide any sort of evidence that he has had sex with her. Nor do they justify attacking Ivanka for having had sex with her father to gain power, which is what that idiotic tweet by Ioffe strongly implied. It does progressives no good at all to legitimate this sort of hateful language. When you try and weasel your way around this, ThrottleJockey, it just makes you look like a loathsome little hate-peddler without anything in the way of ethics or intelligence.

              • DrDick

                This, which was exactly my point. Yes, their relationship is a bit creepy in many ways, but we need to give her the benefit of the doubt.

          • LWA

            Everyone is just assuming that this, like pig-fucking, its an outrageous libel.

            I honestly think it may actually be true.

            Has there ever been a shocking statement or outrageous action by Trump that didn’t turn out to be true?

            • Ronan

              But it’s much worse if it’s true. Particularly if it is/was abusive (which is one of the reasons we shouldn’t go there, I think)

              • LWA

                Very true, but as with all cases of abuse and pedophila, the impulse to protect the victim can sometimes dovetail neatly with shielding the abuser.

        • randy khan

          I’d say the reason that she’s not fair game for this particular comment is that, if it’s true, the likelihood is that there’s a history of sexual abuse and she is a victim, not a perpetrator.

          • Captain Oblivious

            Sorry, but you lose victim status when you help your abuser get elected POTUS.

            In any case, we don’t know. But Ivanka’s relationship with her father is fair game, especially since she appears to be acting as Prime Minister. Ioffe should have used more delicate wording, but it’s entirely fair, given the long history of Trump’s public drooling over his daughter, to ask if she’s sleeping with him.

            • Dilan Esper

              I can’t believe what I am reading in this thread.

              • Nick056

                we hate marlon brando so it’s cool.

            • Linnaeus

              Sorry, but you lose victim status when you help your abuser get elected POTUS.

              No. Just no. This is a lot like saying someone with an abusive partner is no longer a victim if he/she doesn’t leave the partner.

              But Ivanka’s relationship with her father is fair game, especially since she appears to be acting as Prime Minister. Ioffe should have used more delicate wording, but it’s entirely fair, given the long history of Trump’s public drooling over his daughter, to ask if she’s sleeping with him.

              Questioning Ivanka Trump’s role in her father’s administration doesn’t require making the insinuations that Ioffe did, particularly when she has no evidence beyond Donald’s abhorrent musings.

              • randy khan

                This is a lot like saying someone with an abusive partner is no longer a victim if he/she doesn’t leave the partner.

                Precisely.

              • Nick056

                Sorry, but you lose victim status

                Nothing lends credibility to the George Will bullshit about victim status conferring privileges like talking about being a victim as if it were a privilege.

              • DrDick

                Exactly right.

          • DrDick

            This!

        • jamesepowell

          Americans are reluctant to be harsh to any attractive blonde women and they do not like anyone who is. That is why, beginning in the Reagan years, the RWers started using former pageant contestants as spokes-creatures.

          • BiloSagdiyev

            I would like to think that Tomi Lahren has crashed that concept off a Roadrunner-height cliff.

    • Hells Littlest Angel

      This tweet was reckless, outrageous and unconscionable. It’s a disgrace to modern journalism, a disgrace to polite society, and a disgrace to America!
      Also, Julia Ioffe, if you’re reading this: I love you.

  • Hells Littlest Angel

    The allegation is absurd. She’s too old for him now.

  • Linnaeus

    Ioffe, by the way, has apologized for the tweet.

    • ThrottleJockey

      Did you see her apology? She followed up a tweet with his own words about how he’d like to fuck his daughter.

      • Linnaeus

        I did see her apology and linked it. If she followed that up with anything more, I don’t see it in her twitter stream, but maybe I missed something.

        • q-tip

          There was this masterful bit of shade:

          We have a president-elect who popularized “saying what everyone is thinking,” but I guess my phrasing should’ve been more delicate.

          • leftwingfox

            Ha!

          • ThrottleJockey

            There was also the tweet where she said she takes back what she said about Ivanka and will let Trumps words speak for themselves.

            And then quoted him saying he’d like to date his daughter. Myself I’d have quoted him saying she “was a great piece of ass.” Or maybe where he complimented “her rack.”

            Or maybe Ivanka’s reaction to the dad love: “If any other man said those things about me I’d slap him.”

            About the only thing he hasn’t said about his daughter is if she likes anal…But I bet the twisted fuck has sure thought about it.

          • keta

            Yep. Her original tweet, follow-up tweet (linking to vid of Trump’s “if she wasn’t my daughter” creepquote) and then her apology all indicate:

            – she knew exactly what she was saying
            – she knew exactly what reaction it would generate
            – she felt it was important to say

            I look forward to reading her in The Atlantic.

            • leftwingfox

              Same here!

  • pillsy

    It was a stupid and offensive thing to Tweet. I’ve never particularly been bothered when people get into trouble for using the Twitter-thing like idiots, and I’m not gonna start now.

    It’s pretty funny to see all the fucking “straight talk” #MAGA dingbats get bent out of shape over a crass Tweet, though.

    • keta

      The shitstorm she’s brought upon herself will likely be exponentially larger than her experience after a piece on Melania.

      • rm

        I wouldn’t phrase it “brought upon herself.” Nothing justifies the kind of stuff Trump’s followers do.

        • keta

          Oh please. Her tweet was inartful as fuck. She knew what sorts of responses it would generate. Which doesn’t for a fucking moment excuse the feces patty-cake some Trump supporters engage in. But for crissakes she went into eyes wide open (which I frankly admire) so don’t try and paint this as something it’s not.

          • the ordinary fool

            Your point that it doesn’t excuse the “feces patty-cake” of Trump supporters is basically what rm is saying, but you’re doubling down on the “she was asking for it” line. Good work!

            • keta

              Oh, fuck off. I’m in no way saying she “was asking for it.” I’m saying she knew what the the response would be from a certain faction and decided that saying what she wanted to say was worth the repercussions.

              Christ.

              • rm

                I do not think you were intending to victim-blame, but I think your phrasing was unfortunate in a way that is important to call out, and saying that Ioffe is doing this strategically — which I agree may be true, because it’s not like she hasn’t already felt the wrath of Nazi Twitter, and I’m guessing she is made of steel — is very different from the impression left by your first inartful statement.

                • keta

                  And I think it’s unfortunate some people go out of their way to find what they want to see in even anodyne observations.

                  There’s a lot of unfortunate in this world.

                • Nick never Nick

                  This is why maintaining professional standards is appropriate. To say that Julia Ioffe received hideous abuse for publishing an essay on Trump is pointing out how foul his supporters are. To say that Julia Ioffe received hideous abuse for her hideous tweet about Trump and Ivanka having a sexual relationship leaves the situation rather more muddled, to say the least.

                • rm

                  keta, that was a polite “fuck you,” since I think you missed that. I KNOW you thought you were not victim blaming, but you got there anyway.

                • Nick never Nick

                  ‘Victim blaming’ is a word that originally meant to point out that women, or anyone, can’t be blamed for sexual assaults. It would be appropriate here if it was a response to normal journalism — if Ioffe received anti-Semitic, violent, racist, or sexist responses to normal work (as she has in the past).

                  It’s not victim blaming when someone tweets that Trump and Ivanka are having sex with each other, and then gets a dumptruck load of abuse. How is that different from trolling?

                • keta

                  keta, that was a polite “fuck you,” since I think you missed that. I KNOW you thought you were not victim blaming, but you got there anyway.

                  Willful misreading and now condescension.

                  Yep, I’m done.

              • Taters

                Don’t you think a lot of professional journalists and others will be soon faced with similar decisions?

                • keta

                  What decisions?

                • Taters

                  I can’t seem to reply to keta so I’ll reply to myself:

                  I’m saying she knew what the the response would be from a certain faction and decided that saying what she wanted to say was worth the repercussions.

                  That type of decision.

                • keta

                  They already are (faced with similar decisions.)

          • ThrottleJockey

            What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Trump has said much worse.

            • pillsy

              If Congress impeaches Trump for Tweeting like the asshole he is, I’m not gonna complain.

            • Snarki, child of Loki

              Wait, Trump has been doing the nasty with GEESE?1??

              I was sure that he drew the line at sleek, well-coiffed goats.

              • rea

                It’s the ganders that will get him impeached.

                • steverinoCT

                  I think, rather, the gooses.

              • JonH

                I’m just saying, don’t order the foie gras at Trump Grille.

                And not only because it’s cooked poorly.

          • SNF

            I don’t think we should respond to mob harassment and violence by Trump’s followers with “well, they knew that was going to happen when they said mean things about Trump.”

            That way lies self-censorship.

      • kth

        I myself was going to cite the wilding that Ioffe has received at the hands of Trump supporters, but to make rather the opposite point: that perhaps her undeniably tacky remark might be forgiven or mitigated in that light.

        • Nick never Nick

          It isn’t — our side is not going to benefit by abandoning professionalism, or by bringing women’s sexuality into consideration of their actions.

    • Arouet

      BREAKING NEWS:

      Something can be both stupid and offensive and still not justify termination by a third-rate publication struggling to suckle at the teet of the new administration. The real scandal is that they’re trying to regulate ALL of their employees’ speech, whether on behalf of the publication or not.

  • medrawt

    Ms. Ioffe’s tweet was precisely phrased. She neither accused nor implied that PEOTUS was having an incestuous affair; she merely dangled it as the most likely alternative to what is in fact the obvious truth, for rhetorical flourish.

    Because actually, if you were working your way down the list, what WOULD be next after “violating anti-nepotism regulations?”

    • (((max)))

      Ms. Ioffe’s tweet was precisely phrased. She neither accused nor implied that PEOTUS was having an incestuous affair; she merely dangled it as the most likely alternative to what is in fact the obvious truth, for rhetorical flourish.

      Second. I am sorry she felt she had to apologize (understandable given the Trumpites hounding) because that will probably make it worse.

      Because actually, if you were working your way down the list, what WOULD be next after “violating anti-nepotism regulations?”

      People tend to overreact to individual pictures, particularly on Twitter, and this country is crazy about sex, but the Trump-daughter thing is creep, and so is the Melania Trump-son relationship.

      max
      [‘That is all.’]

      • Nobdy

        Rumor has it Barron has autism. If that’s true then Melania comes off as a doting mother in a difficult situation, not creepy at all.

        I don’t like her because, well, she’s married to Donald Trump and is a huge enabler of his horribleness, but I’m not ready to attack her parenting skills, especially if her son has special needs.

    • The Lorax

      Yeah, maybe she’s just taking the semantics from sentential logic very seriously? They say that if p, then p or any q. So, if it’s dark outside; either it’s dark outside, or I can fly. Or, if it’s dark outside; either, it’s dark outside or media outlets like NPR and NYT gave appropriate coverage to Hillary’s e-mail practices.

    • Manny Kant

      Yes! Why do people keep saying she was accusing Trump and Ivanka of incest? That’s very clearly not what she was doing.

    • witlesschum

      This is how I read it, too. She’s assuming Trump’s not actually fucking his daughter, but IS giving his children big roles in his administration. And she said so in a way that was vulgar as fuck to get a big response. She did and I’m sorry she apologized. Probably had to so as her Atlantic job was unaffected.

  • Mike in DC

    A la LBJ, can we get him to publicly deny it?

    • rea

      Rank presidents 1 through 44 as to “Most Likely to Have Had Sex with Daughter” Who is the consensus pick for #1?

      • Nobdy

        James Buchanan approves of this method of ranking U.S. presidents; the only one where he comes out in the good half.

        • The Lorax

          I now know Buchanan had no daughters.

          • rea

            Buchanan only married once, and his husband died shortly after becoming Pierce’s VP..

          • Manny Kant

            Remarkably, Eisenhower is our most recent president with no daughters. Since then, we’ve had Johnson, Nixon, Clinton, Bush 43, and Obama with no sons.

        • wengler

          Buchanan was pretty awful, but he gets sort of a raw deal for being the one at the switch when the country melted down. It was coming, and with the batshit insanity of the Southern plantation class there wasn’t going to be a peaceful transition out of slavery.

          It’s comparable to today in that there is likely not a peaceful transition out of white supremacy/world supremacy for the US. We didn’t have a major war after the last financial collapse because the leaders of the countries that make up the world financial centers were on the same page and didn’t let it happen. Even then it was massively unpopular, left a bunch of people out in the cold and is a major factor in the springboarding the resurgence of fascism worldwide. If 2008 was 1833 when Jackson marched down to South Carolina to remind them who was in power, then the next financial collapse is much more likely to be 1860.

      • JMP

        Hands down Thomas Jefferson, who thought of a good number of his children as property.

        • GeorgeBurnsWasRight

          And his half-sister, literally.

          • Manny Kant

            Sally Hemings was his late wife’s half sister.

      • Brad Nailer

        Trump’s the only one who comes close. Nobody else is even in the game.

    • N__B

      I think the denial should be outsourced to Junior or Lurch.

  • rm

    Well,

    1. The crudity of the tweet, plus the fact that she was on her way out already, makes it easy to understand why they fired her.

    2. This is 0.00000000001% as offensive as the shit Trump said every day for years, and he said in his new America we would no longer have to be “politically correct” to avoid offending anyone’s feelings. So, you know.

    3. This is 0.0000000000000000000000000000001% as offensive as the shitstorm of anti-Semitic threats and abuse that Trump’s followers bombarded her with because she wrote an accurate article.

    So on balance, Politico is shit even if the tweet wasn’t in the best taste. It is a very dark and scary sight to see a publication self-censor to avoid offending the Leader. This is fascist stuff, this is the stuff we said we should resist normalizing.

    The insult didn’t tarnish Politico, their response did.

    Now I want to type the word “fuck” ten million times to express my feelings about the future of our country, but I reckon y’all understand already.

    I am beginning to really hate some figures who are cheering and helping this disaster. I remember in high school we had a guest speaker who had defected from one of the Baltic countries that were forced into the Soviet Union. Her statement on this kind of hatred was that it is frustrated love — when you want to love your country but that is no longer possible.

    • XTPD

      What’s even worse about the tweet is that this about a week after her moving to The Atlantic was announced. Even if the tweet’s a dick move, this is really fucking petty.

    • liberalrob

      Now I want to type the word “fuck” ten million times to express my feelings

      Careful, you won’t be able to get a job at Politico if you do that.

      • GeorgeBurnsWasRight

        Updated Dylan:

        How many “fucks” must someone tweet
        Before they can’t get a job?

  • Matt Stevens

    I google Julia Ioffe, and what’s the first thing I see? “Empress Melania Attacked by Filthy Russian Kike Julia Ioffe.”

    So sorry she offended their delicate sensibilities. (Besides, I thought the Russians were our friends now.)

    • Nobdy

      Only the Christian Russians, DUH! Putin is wonderful because he is a full realization of the virile white male, and Jews aren’t fully white anymore (again.) I mean they were never FULLY white, but their whiteness is currently waning.

      • XTPD

        Christian Russia was also a key pioneer in the art of suppressing rootless cosmopolitanism.

        • BiloSagdiyev

          Why, yes, now that you have reminded me, I must say, her tweet was beyond the pale.

    • dl

      I google Julia Ioffe, and what’s the first thing I see?

      What are you using, Lycos.com?

      • leftwingfox

        Ah, a fellow old man of the internet.

        • tsam

          I’m a Netscape man, myself.

  • AMK

    Politico works by having access that moves political gossip faster than anyone else….it’s less journalism than longform DC Twitter. Of course they’re going to jump on the self-censorship bandwagon–Trump has frozen people out for much less.

  • Nobdy

    She said something extremely crass and they “You can’t quit, you’re FIRED her” on the way out.

    I don’t think this is a big deal or particularly unique to the Trump era.

    On the other hand Politico’s pearl grasping “She has sullied the good name of Politico with her POTTY MOUTH” is some real corporate self-unaware bullshit. On the list of things that has sullied Politico’s name this doesn’t hit the top 500.

    “Donald Trump is giving his children unprecedented and inappropriate power in Washington” is a point that can be made without crude incest references, and is more convincing without them too.

  • liberalrob

    I keep saying that Twitter is a tool of Satan, but nobody listens…

    • Crusty

      Trump does seem to use and like it quite a bit.

    • Snarki, child of Loki

      “I keep saying that Twitter is a tool of Satan, but nobody listens…”

      Yeah, yeah, yeah…tell us what’s BAD about Twitter, why don’t you?

    • witlesschum

      Satanic Temple is a pretty good follow.

  • joel hanes

    What was someone with the ability to see that a square-bladed D-handled garden implement is in fact a spade and the chutzpah to say so out loud doing working for Politico in the first place?

    • Jim in Baltimore

      If it’s square-bladed, it’s not a spade, it’s a shovel.

  • feebog

    Wait, I thought political correctness was a thing of the past, and we should just let it all hang out. Guess it still depends on whose zipper is down.

  • Politico wailing about it’s journalamisitic integritude gave me a much needed laugh. Thanks.

  • Jay B

    I long for the more innocent days of “locker room talk”.

    I hate every fucking person on Twitter.

    • I hate every fucking person on Twitter.

      I would still rather read Paul Krugman’s blog essays, but I do read his tweets.

      • BiloSagdiyev

        I, too, mourn the decline of Papa Krug’s blog output.

    • MyNameIsZweig

      I hate every fucking person on Twitter.

      That seems a bit … overbroad, if you ask me.

      And one thing I will say about Twitter is that, as a company, they at least seem to be aware of the problems their platform has, even if they have proved completely clueless when it comes to how to fix them. Compare that to Zuckerberg’s response to the obvious fake news problem that Facebook has, and you’ll see why I tend not to agree that Twitter is the worst of the social media platforms (Trump’s rants notwithstanding).

  • Nick never Nick

    I don’t care for the “Trump has said worse so that makes it OK” — this is about both Ivanka and Trump, and just because Trump does something nasty, says something foul, doesn’t meant that Ivanka has to be dragged into it. I know that Chelsea Clinton was treated very cruelly by the right, and I’m sure that Obama’s children have been as well in the nastiest corners; let’s not start that with Ivanka.

    And, if Ivanka does take a role in the Trump administration, and if she does terrible things, then attack her for her deeds, not trying to sexualize her relationship with her father. Either it’s wrong, which makes doing so useless, beside-the-point, and malproductive, or it’s right and she’s a victim.

    I can completely see a political reporter getting fired for a Tweet like this, and it’s not the hill I am going to die on for freedom of the press.

    • rm

      I can imagine them either firing her, or condemning the crudity, in a statement that also made clear that they are an independent journalistic outfit. Instead their ethos is “we pretend to have no opinions so that conservatives will like us.” I do agree with you about not using this kind of talk against Ivanka.

      • Nick never Nick

        Yeah, I guess I’m not even going to waste my time thinking about Politico. For me, this is more about maintaining standards on the side I care about — does Julia Ioffe think that this is going to increase her credibility when resisting Trump with journalism? I don’t see how it makes her anything but ineffective, particularly because she is more of a polemicist than a reporter; anything she writes is going to be seen through the lens of this Tweet by a large number of Trump supporters. And, frankly, it is going to confirm their stupidest, worst prejudices about the coastal elite boogeypeople.

        I guess I’m trying to say that I believe Trump needs to be resisted with dignity — sometimes quiet, sometimes loud, sometimes outraged — but dignity and professionalism. The right is excellent at using innuendoes on Twitter, it loves bringing women’s sexuality into their public lives, those are not the battlefields I think we should choose.

        • efgoldman

          it is going to confirm their stupidest, worst prejudices about the coastal elite boogeypeople.

          Her getting up in the morning and typing her byline is going to confirm their worst prejudices, etc….
          The howler monkeys is gonna’ howl.

    • Lizzy L

      +1000
      I think Ioffe’s tweet is ugly — it adds nothing positive or helpful to our political discourse, nor does it support a viable political strategy. It has no utility.

      OTOH, Politico can go suck on poison eggs.

    • Crusty

      While Ivanka cannot control who her father is she has 1) proudly and publicly supported him, 2) allowed herself to be used as cover for his appalling attitudes towards women, 3) allowed herself to be used as cover for the anti-semitic stirrings of his campaign, 4) worked for his company, 5) built her own businesses in the same mold, 5) speechified on his behalf at the convention, etc. The idea that she’s off limits like the Obama girls or something seems off to me.

      • Linnaeus

        Ivanka Trump shouldn’t be off limits with respect to her involvement with her father’s presidential campaign and his presidency, but that doesn’t justify anything and everything that could be said about her.

        • Nick never Nick

          Yes, exactly. I don’t understand why people here find it so hard to grasp that women in public should be criticized for their deeds and words, and not attacked sexually.

          • Ronan

            There’s a lot of space between “criticized for their deeds and words, and not attacked sexually.”
            .

            • Nick never Nick

              And here, Ivanka’s sexuality is being publicly discussed in the most repugnant manner — both by Yoffe and in this blog — so it doesn’t fall into that space at all.

              • Ronan

                Yeah, but your position seems to be that she can only be criticised for things she has said and done. I’m saying there’s no need to stick to such a limited canvass, although I agree that some things (ie ioffes tweet) should be out of bounds.

      • Ronan

        “The idea that she’s off limits like the Obama girls or something seems off to me.”

        Right, I mean do people actually believe that the two are comparable ?

        • DrDick

          Actually they are. Ivanka, to the extent she has an active role in her father’s presidency, is fair game for attacks on her actions as such and for nepotism. She can also be criticized for her public words and actions, but she has the same rights to privacy as anyone else and she should not be subject to baseless sexual innuendo.

    • Ronan

      Chelsea Clinton was a teenager, Obama’s children aswell.
      I mean, look, I’ve said why I don’t think it’s the best line of attack. But this idea from the left that the only ones with agency are rich white men and everyone else needs to be treated with kiddy gloves is bullshit. Ivanka is a grown woman, an asshole as strongly implicated in her father’s rise to power as her two moronic brothers. They all have extraordinary wealth and power, so shouldn’t be exempt from ridicule and satire just because she’s “someone’s daughter.”

      • Nick never Nick

        Who said Ivanka doesn’t have agency? I’m saying women in the public sphere should be criticized or ridiculed for what they do, not for being women. Their sexuality shouldn’t be brought into the picture.

        When Clinton was being attacked with ‘Trump that bitch’, ‘Hillary Sucks but Monica Swallows’ and all sorts of sexual comments, I don’t remember the prevailing opinion on this blog being “has extraordinary wealth and power, so shouldn’t be exempt from ridicult and satire”.

        Would you support the right in talking about Chelsea Clinton fucking Bill, now that she’s not a teenager any more?

        Satire, my ass.

        • Ronan

          I think Chelsea is fair game for criticism, yes. She maintains a high enough public profile and has been involved in her parents foundations and public works.
          If a hypothetical Hillary admin had her filling similar roles that ivanka seems to be taking then she would absolutely be open to criticism/ridicule/satire.
          As i said, not the rhetoric ioffe engaged in, which isn’t legit imo. But then again it was a dumb tweet she apologised for, so who cares.

          Eta not fucking bill though , no. As my first comment makes clear

    • Arouet

      If you focus on how the person who is the target of a politically-motivated firing under an authoritarian is not a perfect snowflake, you will literally never find a hill worth dying on. That’s how these things work.

      • Nick never Nick

        If professionals want to be defended, then they’d better act like professionals, and not produce tweets like this one.

        Out of curiosity, how is Ioffe’s tweet here different from a comment-thread troll?

        • Arouet

          Even granting your premise, comment-thread trolls don’t get fired from their jobs for trolling.

  • rm

    The motto of a responsible press today should be

    THIS MACHINE KILLS FASCISTS

    not we’ve got access to the hottest inside gossip.

    Politico was always noxious, but in normal times that was just disgusting, not a serious problem. Now they are enablers and normalizers of fascism, because they are continuing the way they always have. This moment will either pass with some damage to our nation, or will mark the start of a return to the white supremacist past. If we had a real press it would help us get out of this more quickly. But then if we had a real press Clinton would have won.

    Fuck to some gigantic exponential power.

    EDIT: I’m not defending the tweet by saying this; I am disgusted more by the obsequiousness to power in Politico’s statement.

    • Dr. Ronnie James, DO

      Today I decided to make a blue hat that reads “MAKE AMERICA DEMOCRATIC AGAIN.” Hoping the press adopts this motto as well.

      • tsam

        Media: HATS THAT SAY STUFF BOTH SIDES DO IT

        • Dr. Ronnie James, DO

          :)

          TROUBLING CLOUDS
          SHADOWY QUESTIONS

          BUT SOMETHING
          SOMETHING E-MAILS

  • ploeg

    The problem with the tweet is that it makes an allegation that is not proven, that would be hard to prove, and that would matter a little bit but not too much if it were proven. The other allegation in the tweet is solid and matters a whole lot.

    • efgoldman

      that would matter a little bit but not too much if it were proven.

      WHAT??

      • Gareth

        She’s 35, there’s no law against it.

        • Nick056

          I’m, uh … There totally are laws against it.

        • randy khan

          In New York, it’s a felony: Incest in the third degree

          • Gareth

            Huh, I thought it was just marriage that was illegal. I stand corrected.

      • ploeg

        It would be immoral and disgusting if it were true. Then again, there’s a lot of things that Donald Trump has indisputably done that are immoral and disgusting. The man molests random strangers and casually walks into dressing rooms with minors in them. Sure, incest would top that, but by how much?

        It can also be argued that Trump has hurt legions of people through his corruption, but presidential-level corruption would be a league of its own.

        • randy khan

          I shudder at the thought that it’s possible that incest (and, let’s be frank, if something like that were happening, he also likely would have abused her sexually as a child) is not the uncrossable line for the Republicans and Trump supporters generally. No – I refuse to even contemplate it.

          • ploeg

            One would think that Trump would have been sunk by the picture of him and Ivanka with a statue of copulating parrots. Nah, it’s all just “locker room talk.”

            As I’ve said before, it’s not enough for him to just do it, he has to drop innuendo and wink and grin. But also as I’ve said, corruption is a bigger deal to the body politic.

        • GeorgeBurnsWasRight

          The man molests random strangers

          Not true!

          He only molests the best strangers.

          Stop insulting Trump!!

  • Docrailgun

    That’s “God-Emperor” to you, Campos.

    Sands worms have better hair than El President, though.

  • Craigo

    Crude and unsupported incest tweets are an attention-seeking distraction from the horrible shit that Trump will actually do and has already done. But gotta get them RTs, I guess.

    • MyNameIsZweig

      Right, because calling attention to all the other things you’re so … concerned about has really made a huge dent so far.

  • MilitantlyAardvark

    While y’all were obsessing over the idiotic tweet of the day, this was in the news:

    http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2016/12/nbc-news-putin-personally-directed-anti-clinton-hacking

    Two senior officials with direct access to the information say new intelligence shows that Putin personally directed how hacked material from Democrats was leaked and otherwise used. The intelligence came from diplomatic sources and spies working for U.S. allies, the officials said.

    Putin’s objectives were multifaceted, a high-level intelligence source told NBC News. What began as a “vendetta” against Hillary Clinton morphed into an effort to show corruption in American politics and to “split off key American allies by creating the image that [other countries] couldn’t depend on the U.S. to be a credible global leader anymore,” the official said.

    Trump ought to send Ioffe a yuuge thank you note for distracting us from such petty things as a public acknowledgment that Putin has effectively conducted an act of war against this country.

    • Rob in CT

      Putin – meh, he’s an enemy, and you expect your enemies to fuck with you.

      It’s the collusion on the part of the GOP that has to be the outrage here.

      • tsam

        Well–there is espionage and there’s putting THAT much effort into sabotaging an election. Since there isn’t a whole lot we can do about Putin, we can track down the people who opened the doors for him and lock them up for life.

        Can’t believe they’d do that to their own nation. Well, yes I can, but I would never want to win that way. Not even in this race. A legitimacy problem is a really tough one to fix.

        • Rob in CT

          If there is evidence they actually screwed with our election results themselves (say, by hacking voting machines or something), that would indeed be something different.

          As things stand, however, what they did was (as Slate put it, I think) hack the voters (I’d say the media, but whatever), not our actual election apparatus. I think the distinction matters.

          • tsam

            Per the current evidence, yeah. I’m not so sure there isn’t a whole lot more to learn. I’m in tin foil hat territory here, but a whole bunch of stuff about this election just stinks. I don’t like it.

            • Rob in CT

              Understood. I vaguely recall that months before the election, several states had their voter rolls hacked. Or something like that.

              What stops me from taking this further is thinking about the sheer logistics involved in hacking our ridiculous election “system.” Even if you just work on swing states, the effort would be immense and probably way too hard to hide.

              Whereas just hacking* some emails and throwing negative news stories out (via RT) is relatively easy.

              * IIRC, the Podesta hack was a successful phishing operation. Very simple.

              • tsam

                Yeah–I get that. But then having Republican state secretaries and the right people between, it’s maybe not such a gargantuan task. It didn’t take that many votes to swing them. Target certain counties, and the aggregate changes just enough.

                • Rob in CT

                  Well, that would require outright, deliberate collusion between state-level GOPers and Russian hackers.

                  What we actually know of is that Russian hackers gave information to wikileaks, which gave it out to media outlets who gleefully puffed it up into a big story, and when GOP senators were told that our intelligence agencies had high confidence that this whole thing originated with Russian intelligence, they demanded it be kept under wraps (which is kind of was, but I remember some news stories about it nonetheless. It never became a Huge Story like eeeeeeemails though). They were happy to accept the help to gain power, but I seriously doubt McConnell was working with Russian intelligence hand in glove (though I reserve judgment about Manafort).

                • witlesschum

                  The other problem with the idea that there was actual election-rigging votes disappear for Clinton and/or appear for Trump is that the result in Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin were so much closer than expected, it wasn’t something you could have set up ahead of time. Giving Trump an extra 10,000 votes wouldn’t have been expected to swing Michigan until like 9 p.m. on election night. It would have to be done in real-time, as the election happened, which seems a lot harder.

                  As I understand it, the main thing that made some experts suspicious of the Michigan results was that there were significantly more ballots than usual record with no vote for president. Well, I don’t think it’s hard to explain why that might have been, when you had an correctly demonized garbage fire running against an unfairly but sucessfully demonized Hillary Clinton.

      • witlesschum

        This, though I think of “enemy” as describing something a bit stronger. More like opponent or adversary. Putin is an unpleasant figure on the international scene, but it’s not like sort of situation where the U.S. and his Russia can’t share a planet comfortably.

        The idea that it’s an act of war is unhinged. If we really bombed St. Petersburg in response to Putin trying to rig an election, we’d be majorly overreacting.

        • Rob in CT

          Yup, friendly amendment accepted. Opponent/adversary is better phrasing.

  • tsam

    Interesting comments!

    Look, you can’t be a professional journalist and say that kind of stuff. You can, however, throw his own words in his face: “Trump would date Ivanka’s nice rack if she weren’t his daughter. Since she is, she’s getting high level jobs in government.”

    • DrDick

      That would have actually been acceptable, as it places all the onus on Trump himself.

  • njorl

    I’m not saying I think Trump sleeps with his daughter. There’s no real evidence for that. But the story is out there. People are talking about it. It’s being discussed in legitimate news circles. It would be irresponsible for the major networks and cable news organizations NOT to cover it 24/7 for the next 6 weeks.

  • TopsyJane

    Ioffe’s a professional journalist. She should have known better and Politico isn’t the only news or “news” organization that would have canned or at the very least suspended her for this.

    Also, as others have pointed out, she’s provided a useful distraction that can actually be of potential help to Trump.

    Ivanka couldn’t help being born into that family. But she certainly doesn’t seem to mind being her papa’s, ahem, favorite.

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