Home / General / Sssh, honey. Jonah Hill is busy playing video games and denying the existence of god. Because god won’t let him be his authentic self.

Sssh, honey. Jonah Hill is busy playing video games and denying the existence of god. Because god won’t let him be his authentic self.

Comments

By vacuumslayer

On May 8, 2014

At 11:14 am

In General

796 Views

I found this in my twitter feed.

Sometimes, when a Jonah Hill, a Jeff Garlin and an anus love each other very much, they make a baby. And the baby looks like this picture.

I can’t decide if it’s a great thing or the greatest thing currently on the Internet. One thing I do know is that Jonah Hill is a.) very rude and b.) dates women who seem to have a disorder that makes them unable to discern seasons.

No, but seriously, this is just awful in so many ways I hardly know where to begin snarking. (I do wonder if anyone at Reason knows that girls/women also play video games. Probably not.)

So instead of doing that, I guess I’ll talk about something a little more substantive: organized atheism taking up social causes. The skeptic/atheist blogosphere has been slightly abuzz with the topic lately.

To sum things up, some prominent members of the community think that taking up social causes will benefit it in two ways: 1.) it will draw more people of color/women/people who feel similarly disenfranchised by the community to atheism 2.) it will drive out the riffraff. (By riffraff, I, of course , mean ~~young misogynists~~ libertarians.)

I think the argument that atheism, technically, has little to do with social causes–outside of making sure people remain free of religious burden–is sound. It’s just that I can’t think of a downside of taking them up anyway. It seems like a win-win proposition to me.

mike in dc

To be fair, Jonah Hill voices a major character in the latest installment of Grand Theft Auto, GTA V. His character in the game is an avid video gamer and kind of a prick. So, the cover may be a reference to that. On the other hand, it IS Reason, so it probably is best to assume the worst.
- mark f
  
  I think he looks like Troy Aikman.
- Yeggman
  
  Yeah, IIRC this is a slightly modified GTA V promotional image.
- Daniel Coyle
  
  Actually, it’s Danny Tamberelli who voices that character; Hill isn’t involved in the game.
- BoredJD
  
  This is an understandable mistake. The character looks and sounds like Jonah Hill (or Josh Gad) but is really voiced by Danny Tamberelli.
  
  GTA V really eschewed trying to get more well-known voice actors like VC or SA. For example, the guy who played Michael had a bit part in an episode of Boardwalk Empire.
  - Dan Coyle
    
    And Trevor recently appeared on Broad City.
    - Dread Hierarch Scrotum-Piranha (objectively a standard deviationist)
      
      Well, my old eyes thought that Chris Christie was being his usual gracious self to Jennifer Aniston.
- LeftWingFox
  
  The interplay between the image and the subtext just makes it worse. (Games are making America Freer! and More Fun! By flipping off nagging ~~eye candy~~ girls!)
  - LeftWingFox
    
    My bad, it’s “shut up a sec”, not the bird.
- Deptfordx
  
  Alternative title of that picture I’ve heards going around.
  
  “10 minutes before the Murder-Suicide Pact”.
  - N__B
    
    No way she waits that long before grabbing the sticky gun he keeps in his sock drawer.
J. Otto Pohl

Well I suppose if atheism wishes to become an organized movement rather than just an absences of faith it could officially adopt social causes. Maybe such a movement could model itself after the old Soviet League of the Godless and later League of the Militant Godless. The Bible, especially the New Testament and Koran are both full of injunctions that could be interpreted as social causes, particularly with regards to helping the poor. Different denominations and sects vary as to their charitable works. But, most organized religions do some work in this regard. If atheism were to become a church like movement for the Godless I suppose it could also follow the same lines.
- Slocum
  
  Shut the fuck up.
  - Brownian
    
    Try framing that in the form of a J. Otto Pohl Musing™ for best results:
    
    “Well I suppose J. Otto Pohl could follow the lead of every major religion’s god(s) and shut the fuck up.”
    - Origami Isopod
      
      Maybe the genius behind Subversive Cross-Stitch could be persuaded to do a commission for LGM:
      
      J. Otto Pohl: Shut the fuck up.
      
      A JPG of the final work could go in the sidebar/
  - Barry
    
    I agree with Slocum!
    
    Hey, Slocum – want to go out, get drunk and oppress independently-minded grad students and Ph.D.’s?
    - N__B
      
      “Kulaks” could be the new terms for “independently-minded grad students and Ph.D.’s”.
- TribalistMeathead
  
  Different denominations and sects vary as to their charitable works.
  
  Yes, some do very little, while others do none at all.
  - J. Otto Pohl
    
    Some do quite a bit. Catholic Relief Services, Episcopal Relief and Development, Lutheran World Relief, the Mennonite Central Committee, and American Friends Service Committee all have done some good work in the past.
    - TribalistMeathead
      
      Well I supposed that doesn’t take into account the scores that do very little or none at all.
      - Malaclypse
        
        Yes, but it does show that you posited a false dichotomy to score cheap rhetorical points.
    - timb116
      
      Hell, it’s one of the five tenets of Islam
    - njorl
      
      Generally, if you give money to a church or religion, you’re paying to feed, clothe and house priests or ministers. If you want to give money to a religious charity, you have to give it to a specific charitable organization, like Catholic Charities.
      - J. Otto Pohl
        
        That is why I named the relief committees of various religious denominations above.
      - Another Holocene Human
        
        “Catholic Charities” is a Catholic dominionist front organization that receives most of its funding from state governments to provide program services. They do adoptions, ensuring that the most perverse and medieval set of rules are followed and shielding the state from having to answer for violating the UN Convention on Human Rights with respect to adoptees. They’re pretty infamous for not allowing same-sex parent adoptions but there’s more there, trust me.
        
        If you’re a dumbass and want to throw your money at this program, or some sort of jerk devoid of empathy who thinks Catholic Charities is right on, by all means–they’re tax exempt–go for it.
FMguru

It’s based on an actual promotional image from Grand Theft Auto:
- rea
  
  Good catch. Note that they put him in a suit, but kept the bong.
  - RogerAiles
    
    Reason got rid of the crusty, stained sock, because Reason readers would become frightened that the feds had taken the image from a drone hovering outside their window.
  - Jeremy
    
    For some reason, they replaced the soft drink cup with a can of Flavored malt liquor. I guess that’s what libertarians drink while sitting at home gaming in a suit.
- The Temporary Name
  
  I don’t understand the various inclusions and removals. Ms. Bikini-Boots stays and girlie poster goes…the bong stays presumably because POT YEAH but the soda is now Four Loko…the chips go and are replaced by…well what is that? A 3D-printed gun or something?
  - rea
    
    Different finger, of course, but note also that the Reason cover has the woman’s mouth open and an angrier expression on her face.
    - DrDick
      
      She is talking to a libertarian and not a gangster, so it is not surprising that she is angrier.
      - Barry Freed
        
        I love this comment so much.
  - DrSubstantiveComment – Processed in a Facility That Also Handles Snark
    
    A 3D-printed gun or something?
    
    OMG, I didn’t see that at first, and I think you’re right! THat looks like a trigger.
    - DrSubstantiveComment – Processed in a Facility That Also Handles Snark
      
      Just googled it, and yep, they look like that.
      
      Oh, Reason…you scamps
      - The Temporary Name
        
        What a wonderful vision of America. Drunk, stoned and armed, doing nothing at all of note, and then some cranky woman comes up and starts complaining…
        
        Warren Terra
        
        Drunk, amped, stoned, armed, doing nothing of note, interacting badly with women, and besuited.
        
        Derpwater Horizon
        
        Ahh, so yes. Wall Street
        
        DrS
        
        Damnit
  - TG Chicago
    
    The Four Loko is probably because the Four Loko formula with caffeine and other energy drink stuff was banned. Unfreedomy,
    - njorl
      
      It’s so annoying when you pass out before getting your judgement as impaired as you’d like it.
- Scott Lemieux
  
  So it’s based on the Donalde with an imaginary girlfriend?
Sly

Original image.

1) The character Jonah Hill voices, Jimmy, is a caricature of a 20-something privileged kid who refuses to get a job and stays in his room all day smoking pot and playing video games. I suppose putting him in a suit is supposed to add some anarcho-capitalist flavor.

2) The woman is his sister, not his girlfriend. Changing the image so that “Jimmy” is giving his sister The Wrong Finger might be an implicit concession that libertarians regularly come off as dudebro misogynists, and they’re trying to change that, but this might be wishful thinking on my part.
- Just Dropping By
  
  Since one of the points that Reason articles about video games typically make is that they are played by a wide variety of people, putting the character in a suit is subverting the “establishment” stereotype of gamers.
  - rea
    
    But note, as I say above, they kept the bong.
    - Just Dropping By
      
      Since one of the points that Reason articles about marijuana use typically make is that it is consumed by a wide variety of people, putting the character in a suit is subverting the “establishment” stereotype of stoners.
  - basement cat
    
    But not going so far as to subvert the stereotype that doods are the people who play video games and women are the people who nag them about it.
    - FMguru
      
      Reason knows its target audience.
  - Royko
    
    The suit makes him seem like so much more of a jerkwad.
    
    I don’t know if it’s because it makes him look like a Young Republican type or because while the original guy was just a comfortable slob, this version clearly is willing to take the time to groom himself in a business fashion but can’t be bothered to pick up his damn room.
    
    I don’t know what kind of mind it takes to look at him and think “freer — and more fun!”
    
    (And that’s not even getting to the misogyny. The pointed index finger makes it creepier than the original.)
    - bspencer
      
      So it wasn’t just me? The “ssh” finger is WAY more offensive.
      - Lee Rudolph
        
        Huh? I’ve never found puTTY’s finger client to be offensive in the least.
      - Warren Terra
        
        A stoner kid (or any surly teenager) flipping someone off (or using the forefinger to tell them to shut up and wait) is rather par for the course. Put them in a suit and it becomes worse no matter which finger it is – but at least the middle finger would be mere hostility. The forefinger is a symbol that they are less important than you and must wait, and this interacts with the suit in an unfortunate manner.
      - mark
        
        Yes, something about the combination of suit and index finger makes it worse. At least in part it’s because it’s clear he got home, couldn’t be bothered to take off his shoes or tie before grabbing the console, so certainly she’s not worth any time.
        
        A middle finger would at least be hostility, showing some level of engagement. Index finger is signalling the woman is completely beneath notice.
JWR

You’ve gotta love the To line on the address label. So imaginative!
- sharculese
  
  I would not be surprised to find out Katha Pollitt subscribes to Reason. Y’know, a keep an eye on what Team Angryboy are hopped about today thing.
  - TribalistMeathead
    
    Or Reason just gave her a subscription.
ranchandsyrup

I think it looks like how a young more glibertarian Chris Christie would view himself.

But I’m objectively despicable, obvs.
- elm
  
  I was also thinking it looked like Christie. Glad I wasn’t the only one.
  - joe from Lowell
    
    Thirded.
    
    Young Chris Christie.
    - DAS
      
      Fourthed? Fifthed? I need a fifth?
  - Oregon Beer Snob
    
    Yeah, if bspenslayerwater hadn’t suggested Hill that’s what I would’ve thought immediately too.
Ronan

Organised athetism gives me the heevy jeevies. Also, a little unfair to try and push your political opponents out of the ‘atheist community’ by politicising it.
- NonyNony
  
  This is a crock of shit. They can (and have) start their own atheist movements. Atheist humanists have long been associated with social activism and this is just a continuation of that.
  
  The only difference is that now a bunch of libertarian atheist whiners who think they own the atheism tag are pissed off that humanist atheists are doing what they’ve been doing for centuries, just on the internet.
  - Ronan
    
    hey, crock of shit is my term
    - Ronan
      
      i invented it
      - Bill Murray
        
        I’m sorry, crock of shit was, in the first version of Matthew extant, one of the gift of the Magi to the special snowflake baby Jesus. A later mistranslation changed crock of shit to myrrh (this wasn’t noticed because no one doing the copying (i.e. Rob Schneider)knew what myrrh was). So, clearly crock of shit comes from the Bible, and unless you are 2000 years old or own the Bible copyright, you could not have invented it.
        
        N__B
        
        Myrrh is the pirate word for “ocean” which is why fish-women are known as myrrhmaids.
        
        JWR
        
        This is why I so love LG&M. I learn so much! ;-)
  - herr doktor bimler
    
    Atheist humanists have long been associated with social activism and this is just a continuation of that.
    
    Yep. The British Humanist Association dates back to, lessee, 1896.
    - The Temporary Name
      
      Das religiöse Elend ist in einem der Ausdruck des wirklichen Elendes und in einem die Protestation gegen das wirkliche Elend. Die Religion ist der Seufzer der bedrängten Kreatur, das Gemüth einer herzlosen Welt, wie sie der Geist geistloser Zustände ist. Sie ist das Opium des Volks.
      
      But the darned socialists never did anything for anyone anyway.
      - Another Holocene Human
        
        pedant
        
        But Marx was an academic writing a book, an avowed non-Marxist, he didn’t organize a movement.
        
        Robert Ingersoll, on the other hand…
        
        /pedant
        
        The Temporary Name
        
        But Marx was an academic writing a book, an avowed non-Marxist, he didn’t organize a movement.
        
        Yes, but the movement didn’t really forget that.
- njorl
  
  All communities are intrinsically politicized.
  - Ronan
    
    yes, of course. But thats also largely a meaningless soundbite. What the OP is asking is should ‘we’ politicise atheism in a way that will specifically drive out certain types of atheists (in this case libertarians). So that’s the context.
    Of course there’s no real, singular, homogenous ‘atheist community’ so my comment was a little facetious, but the general point is ‘should we live in a world where we never have to deal with (certain) political views we dont like?’ And where even the clubs we create that have some cross ideological ties should be broken down along more specific tribal lines
  - LeftWingFox
    
    Pretty much this.
    
    You could have an anime club or a knitting club; the second you have a bigot and the target of their bigotry in the same group, sides will be taken and it becomes “political”.
  - jim, some guy in iowa
    
    couple of friends have been on the boards of local churches, and they can tell quite a few stories about internal politics. one board voted to hire a new pastor. it was a split vote, and one of the guys on the losing side spent the next two years working to undermine the new pastor and finally succeeded. so what the hell- if atheists want to organize, and have even more of that kind of fun, I say let ’em have it
- Origami Isopod
  
  The status quo is always as political as its opponents.
  
  Also, misogynist fuckstains who harass women out of movements deserve to be pushed right out of them. That goes well beyond “disagreement of opinion.” Maybe you ought to read up on some of what’s been going on in the atheist community for the last three years.
  - Ronan
    
    im not arguing against sidelining misogynists/racists etc..this was specifically someone who held different political positions (ie libertarians)
    - Origami Isopod
      
      From the first link in the OP:
      
      I’ve already heard, many many many many times (just yesterday, in fact), that African American atheists get very alienated when they see atheist groups and organizations totally ignoring shitty public education, grinding poverty, systematic disenfranchisement of black voters, racist police and prison policies, the school-to-prison pipeline, the new Jim Crow of the drug war, etc. — and yet working like gangbusters to get the Ten Commandments out of City Halls. And I have heard many many many many women say that they get very alienated when atheist groups and organizations steer clear of reproductive rights, or even hateful misogyny and sexual harassment/ assault within our own communities, because these issues are too “divisive” or “distracting.” I am one of those women.
      
      Who do we care more about alienating?
      
      Which is the greater priority?
      - Ronan
        
        Sure Id seen it. But there’s going to be a lot of selection bias in who Greta Christina talks about this with. There are undoubtedly many POC’s and women who are atheist but *dont* support concentrating on (or care about) those topics. There’s obviously a diversity of opinion among women and POC on these subjects. So by politicising it towards the political concerns of the left these people are also being written out.
        (just to add, Im not saying racism/misogyny shouldnt be pushed back against, or that efforts to expand away from a white male libertarian base – if thats what there is – is a bad idea. Im just thinking there are probably ways to do that that dont tie atheism specifically to supportfor left wing social policies)
        
        atheist
        
        So by politicising it towards the political concerns of the left these people are also being written out.
        
        As if there could be an “apolitical” atheist! Just by being an atheist, one is potentially seen as a threat to the social order because one is questioning an important source of social control. If you think that’s apolitical, you have another thing coming.
      - wjts
        
        Not to dismiss the very valid concerns and problems articulated in the quote, but it strikes me as being a bit like saying “I’ve already heard, many many many many times (just yesterday, in fact), that African American aquaculture activists get very alienated when they see aquaculture groups and organizations totally ignoring shitty public education, grinding poverty, systematic disenfranchisement of black voters, racist police and prison policies, the school-to-prison pipeline, the new Jim Crow of the drug war, etc. — and yet working like gangbusters to fight relaxed pollution standards in area waterways.”
        
        Origami Isopod
        
        Atheism/skepticism and waterways activism are apples and oranges, though. On the one hand you have a group that is fighting to combat religious political hegemony, which in the U.S. is very right wing, and which is also urging people to think skeptically about what they’ve been taught. On the other, you have a group that is narrowly focused on one issue.
    - Oregon Beer Snob
      
      The Venn diagram of misogynists/racists and libertarians is typically drawn as one circle.
      - Rhino
        
        I would have to take some issue with this. There are plenty of libertarians who are neithe of these things. But then there are probably less than ten thousand real libertarians in the whole world.
        
        However, I would say 90% of people who self identify as ‘libertarians’ are both racist and mysogynistic, because most of the people claiming to be libertarians are just republicans who want to be able to smoke lot and buy sex without going to jail.
        
        Ps: libertarianism is still pretty stupid, but we shouldn’t conflate them with wingnuts like Davey Boy, because that’s just mean.
        
        Ann Outhouse
        
        There are plenty of libertarians who are [ins]good at pretending to be[/ins] neithe of these things.
        
        FTFY
        
        Oregon Beer Snob
        
        Thanks for doing that so I didn’t need to.
        
        atheist
        
        90% of people who self identify as ‘libertarians’ are both racist and mysogynistic, because most of the people claiming to be libertarians are just republicans who want to be able to smoke lot and buy sex without going to jail
        
        If 90% of group X are misogynists, I think it’s fair to say that misogyny defines group X.
    - Anonymous
      
      What’s the difference between “misogynists/racists” and libertarians?
      - timb116
        
        Oh, I love these sorts of jokes….
        
        I don’t know what IS the difference between “misogynists/racists” and libertarians?
        
        on a serious note, I disdain Libertarianism as much as the next dude, but turning a blind eye toward misogynists and racists is the same as being one.
        
        I mean, white people comprise the vast majority of said groups and I am not one of those three just because I’m white. Seriously, check out this poll. My fellow crackers are assholes
        
        http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/are-white-republicans-more-racist-than-white-democrats/
        
        The MRA
        
        what IS the difference between “misogynists/racists” and libertarians?
        
        Five bucks, just like in town
        
        Anonymous
        
        on a serious note, I disdain Libertarianism as much as the next dude, but turning a blind eye toward misogynists and racists is the same as being one.
        
        Wot
      - atheist
        
        What’s the difference between “misogynists/racists” and libertarians?
        
        The straight-up racists don’t waste as much of your time.
  - Another Holocene Human
    
    +9000
    
    Fuck those guys. Most of the people pushing for change now tried to outreach to young people from existing structures and got sexually harassed, threatened, assaulted, or saw their friends get sexually harassed or assaulted or called a liar and crucified online, where of course the firestorm raging from bitching on forums devoted to hating the witch who suggested being intimidated isn’t cool to outright criminal threats, bravely made anonymously, of course. A+ isn’t new–it’s been around for a couple of years. But what’s changed is that all of the ugly has come to light and a lot of people can’t support the old conventions, organizations, and leaders any more because they won’t make their gathering and their spaces safe for everyone. Not even physically safe, never mind being open, welcoming, and healthy.
- JL
  
  It’s already politicized – how many people currently associate the atheist community near-entirely with white male libertarians? A lot. How many people does that discourage from engaging with it? I suspect more than a few. The only question is how it will be politicized in the future.
  
  In a world where people are oppressive a-holes to each other, including some always means excluding others.
  - Origami Isopod
    
    Exactly this. The problem is that the white libertarian dudes are perceived as more important members of the “club” than everyone else.
    
    Given demographic trends in the United States alone, this is shooting themselves in the foot. But, also, considering that mothers have traditionally been the parents who inculcate religion into children, driving away women in general and scoffing at the idea of providing onsite daycare for mothers who wish to attend atheist conventions? Just as stupid.
    - Ann Outhouse
      
      And much of the problem is that the most public faces of the movement have included Hitchens (dead, of course) and Dawkins, who pretty much embody the clueless racist/sexist privileged white dudebro and have said all manner of stupid things to prove it.
      - Origami Isopod
        
        Let’s not forget Sam “Racial profiling is awesome!” Harris.
      - N__B
        
        As awful as Elevatorgate was, it did a nice job of getting people to take positions that revealed whether they considered actual people – a group that shockingly includes non-whitemales – to be more important than beliefs. I’m an atheist with zero interest in religion*, but I can’t see ever getting involved with any organization full of the shitheads who have crawled out from under rocks in the last few years.
        
        *Amusingly, Mrs__B has negative interest. I sometimes have to convince her that just because a work of fiction discusses religion (e.g., GoT and BSG) doesn’t mean she won’t enjoy it.
      - atheist
        
        Dawkins should learn when to shut the fuck up.
  - Another Holocene Human
    
    It’s already politicized – how many people currently associate the atheist community near-entirely with white male libertarians? A lot.
    
    Indeed. I followed online atheism and subscribed to skeptical mags for a long time. And as the old generation died off a group of younger libertarian white males took over these groups and started being much more open about their politics. There were good things happening too but the libertarian takeover turned into a joke that wasn’t funny over the last few years.
    
    AU is the only group I still support. They do really good work. Ironically, they are not an atheist organization or even skeptics. They are a multi-faith group that works on church-state separation. I’ve started supporting ACLU as well.
- LeeEsq
  
  If atheism is organized, can I get a cushy job in its organizaiton where I get paid a six figure salary with benefits merely for arguing with religious people on the internet?
  - Ronan
    
    Sure, but bear in mind you’ll also be first against the wall when the counterrevoluion comes
    - timb116
      
      worth it
      - Ronan
        
        bear in mind also that your six figure salary will begin with at least 3 zeros
    - guthrie
      
      I thought they burnt heretics at the stake?
- Uncle Ebeneezer
  
  How about this for a crazy idea: Subgroups!
  
  1.) One group (currently represented by Atheism+/Freethoughtblogs etc.) for atheists who want to promote and practice political activism with other atheists and want a diverse community free of racism, sexism, mra’s, etc.
  
  And 2.) One group for all the people who disagree politically or think that atheism should be all about philosophical navel-gazing and not politically charged, where sexists and racists can be comfortable.
  
  I don’t really see a downside except for the fact that people in group 2 may not like being associated with the asshole element.
  - Ronan
    
    NOOOOOO
    
    let me put my perspective this way (takes out pipe blowing bubbles) One day I accidentally walked past the AGM for Brit civil rights group Liberty (who I like but never did anything for ie campaigning, donating etc)
    As I was bored I decided to go to the AGM, and this specific question came up (from one of those old school, get the government outa my garden tories) who worried that the org was starting to embrace other left wing positions (specifically he didnt want any part in anti religious ones) Some back and forth ensued and the head of liberty at the time Shami Chakrabarti (not white, not male) made the point that they would not, institutionally, push any policies that would split the organisation. I think she was right, personally. And I think you can attract non libertarian non white males without going hole hog leftwing, policy wise.
    
    I dont know what organised atheism hopes to achieve. If they want to influence (religious based) policy, then I’d imagine it would be a fools errand to expand to encompass general leftist politics. If they want to convert people to atheism, I guess it doesnt matter (or depends who they hope to convert) If it’s just a club for likeminded people, then I guess it doesnt matter at all. If they want to reform the US justice system, well there are probably better ways (and organisations) to do that.
    - Ronan
      
      perhaps the reason people arent joing organised atheism is because its anthema to a loada athesists
      
      kind of the point, imo
      - Ronan
        
        anathema
    - Ronan
      
      i have a feeling this little story of mine is not going to convince anyone
      
      and i wouldnt blame them, tbh
      - DrS
        
        I don’t know what an ‘AGM’ is.
        
        Ronan
        
        annual general meeting
        
        or to be clearer (a general meeting that meets annually)
        
        (once a year, they meet.for a meeting)
        
        Hogan
        
        So you’re saying that once a year, or as you might say annually, they have a general meeting? That is general?
        
        Ronan
        
        they have a meeting thats generally annual, wait no .. they have a meeting of generals annually .. no thats not it, they meet to genuflect anally .. ah fuck it, I cant remember
        
        N__B
        
        They meet, generally, once a year. Sometimes not.
        
        DrS
        
        I don’t get it.
    - atheist
      
      The thing is that in order to “mainstream” atheism, they will have to start appealing to demographics beyond self-satisfied middle-class white males. In order to do that, they will have to pay attention to the issues that affect people outside that demographic.
      
      If they were to pay attention to such issues (sexism, racism), they would indeed alienate libertarians and other right wingers. However, they would also potentially gain a much wider audience. The thing is that there is no way to satisfy the right wing and also widen the audience, because the libertarians, the MRA’s & the neoconservatives are inherently against such changes.
NonyNony

Has Jonah Hill actually done something to generate the hate that I missed, or is the hate directed at the protected-by-parody Jonah Hill on the cover of the magazine?

(I ask honestly because I seriously don’t know much about Jonah Hill outside of the fact that he’s in some movies that I like and in some movies that I don’t care much for.)
- bspencer
  
  I like Jonah Hill. I just think the guy on the cover looks like him.
  
  Are people not getting my jokes?
  - nixnutz
    
    And Jeff Garlin I’m guessing, Jeff Garner is a reasonably-attractive youngish fashion designer (although I’m sure there are many others of whom I’m unaware).
    - bspencer
      
      Brainfart.
  - The MRA
    
    everyone knows chicks aint’t funny
    - N__B
      
      Ducklings, OTOH, are hi-larious.
- Seedeevee
  
  Sounds like bspencer hates video games and Jonah Hill.
  
  For some Reason.
mrmcd

Personally, I’m a fan of the 3D printed gun, the Fourloko that’s apparently the size of his calves, and the magazine cover that is a portal to an infinitely recursive dimension of endless libertarians. Hypbro-space, if you will.

All it’s missing is bitcoin.
- TribalistMeathead
  
  And an e-cig.
  - Rhino
    
    Needs more trilby
    - Autonomous Coward
      
      Yes, this.
      
      (And by “Yes, this.” I mean, of course, “Noooooooooooo!”)
      - Barry Freed
        
        This thread is perfect.
  - That kid in the corner
    
    Yes, an e-cig, and the lady’s pointing to the no-smoking sign. Brilliant
- dave
  
  The magazine cover within the magazine cover is awesome. Its exactly like Colbert’s self-portrait on his show. Conservatives cannot be parodied.
- Roger That
  
  BTW that’s not a suit he’s wearing, that’s argyria from colloidal silver.
- Oregon Beer Snob
  
  All it’s missing is bitcoin.
  
  Also lube and a buncha used tissues.
Jerry Vinokurov

Who plays video games dressed in a suit and tie is what I want to know?
- bspencer
  
  A libertarian.
- sharculese
  
  Kevin Spacey.
  - TribalistMeathead
    
    Also the answer to the question “who watches porn fully clothed with their hands outside their pants?”
  - Ronan
    
    stalin
- DrSubstantiveComment – Processed in a Facility That Also Handles Snark
  
  It shows just how respectible he is, cause he’s got a job that requires a suit, but don’t worry, bro. He still games HARD
  - Autonomous Coward
    
    No job that you would wear a suit to (even for an interview) wouldn’t do drug testing so I’m not sure how successful he could possibly be given the bong stage left.
    
    Also that suit is going to smell like bud and that will be a lot less funny that you think it will be.
    - timb116
      
      My job doesn’t drug test and I have to wear suits rather frequently
      - Autonomous Coward
        
        But your suits probably don’t reek like a head shop.
        
        timb116
        
        After being with my clients, they might. Still, good point
    - TribalistMeathead
      
      I made it through the first 12 years of my career without being drug tested and I had to wear a suit to work a whole bunch of times, both to interviews and while employed there.
      - Autonomous Coward
        
        Pfff, look at these squares with their “careers with places that respect the dignity and privacy of their employees”.
        
        What a bunch of nerds.
      - JMP
        
        I’ve always had to wear at least a jacket and tie to work, and I’ve never been drug tested.
    - Just Dropping By
      
      No job that you would wear a suit to (even for an interview) wouldn’t do drug testing
      
      Wow, do you live in your parents’ basement or something? Because that’s an extremely bizarre statement to make on this particular blog — lawyers and law professors both frequently wear suits and I’ve never heard of a private law firm or a law school that conducted routine drug testing….
      - Autonomous Coward
        
        Well, good for you I guess? Go around and ask the computer janitors if they get drug tested, the answer might surprise you.
        
        The fact remains, that suit smells like ass and he should be ashamed to be wearing it.
        
        Autonomous Coward
        
        Also,
        
        >Be high-SES worker.
        >See low-SES worker.
        >Act surprised when low-SES worker is drug tested.
        >Determine low-SES worker must be basement dweller.
        
        Keep enjoying your privilege you classist pig.
        
        TribalistMeathead
        
        The fact remains, that suit smells like ass and he should be ashamed to be wearing it.
        
        Maybe he takes it off before smoking.
        
        What a weird point to be pushing.
        
        Autonomous Coward
        
        Well, no, what started as me making a joke about how he’s going to lose his job because he was smoking pot (and that this cluelessness links to the greater cluelessness of libertarians about all maters reality-related) has somehow turned into a discussion of how my family and I must live in a basement.
        
        Pray continue, I do so enjoy being demeaned for the conditions of work that are forced on me.
        
        Jordan
        
        Well, I thought the suit joke was funny.
        
        /never wears a suit for the job, was drug tested.
      - Captain Blicero
        
        Not sure why you assume AC’s a law professor or lawyer. There are plenty of non-lawyers and non-academics who comment here. And that wasn’t even the offensive part, just the idiotic part! You might not be objectively despicable, but you’re close.
    - njorl
      
      Jobs that require suits make it less likely that you’ll be drug tested. If you schlep boxes around a warehouse, you’re going to be drug tested. If you perform brain surgery you probably won’t.
      - Autonomous Coward
        
        If I saw someone in a suit performing brain surgery I’d probably insist that he be drug tested.
        
        Also probably a referral to the state medical board, or at least the hospital ombudsman?
      - DrS
        
        Jobs that require suits make it less likely that you’ll be drug tested.
        
        Yeah, Wall Streeters still wear suits, right? Guessing they still do piles of drugs?
        
        N__B
        
        When I was in high school, I had a minimum wage ($2.15!) job as a messenger for a law firm. In those glorious days of 1981, you could choke on the clouds of pot smoke drifting over the Trinity Church graveyard when the brokers took lunch and hung out there.
        
        I’ve got nothing against pot, but that memory resurfaces whenever I hear about how serious and important Wall Streeters are.
  - Stan Gable
    
    He still games HARD
    
    …and leaves handguns lying on the floor next to his foot. It’ll be less fun though when he reaches down for his bong and blows his foot off.
    - The prophet Nostradumbass
      
      Less fun for him, anyway.
TribalistMeathead

One upside of atheists taking up social causes is that it would rebut the argument that it’s impossible to be moral without believing in a higher power.
- ChrisTS
  
  Somehow, if hundreds of years of moral philosophy have not rebutted that, I doubt socially active atheism will.
  - Tom Servo
    
    Um. Ok. Moral philosophy may not have rebutted that, but millions of people’s lived experiences have.
  - Slippery Jim
    
    O Rly?
    “In arguing that science has to reject almost everything common sense tells us about reality and our place in it, I am going against a Naturalistic tradition whose leading figure is the sainted Daniel Dennett. Dan has done more than any one to advance the naturalistic program of giving answers to the persistent questions that reconcile common sense—the manifest image, in Wilfred Sellers’ words—with science. But a lot of other philosophers have helped to try to advance this agenda. I honor them all, but I deem their program a failure by the standards that they set themselves. Two examples: Naturalists either violate Hume’s dictum is/ought dictum or reject it without good arguments. Sam Harris wrote a whole book steadily doing so, The Moral Landscape. Intentionality—the aboutness of propositional thoughts: a half century of the philosophy of psychology and we still haven’t figured out how it is even possible.”
    
    http://www.3ammagazine.com/3am/the-mad-dog-naturalist/
    - Steve LaBonne
      
      That’s good stuff. Thanks for the link.
Origami Isopod

Did anyone else (who doesn’t game) brainfart and think “Jonah Goldberg” at first?
- Lee Rudolph
  
  (raises hand)
- Autonomous Coward
  
  Ah. I was too embarrassed to be the only one.
- njorl
  
  I thought “Seth Rogan”.
  - Origami Isopod
    
    Yeah, but I saw the name “Jonah” and then the illustration and hence the confusion. Then I realized there wasn’t enough stubble.
Chilly

Gotta give Reason this, they definitely know their audience.
- bspencer
  
  Precisely
Francis

The last time I turned down sex for a video game I was running a nasty fever and [stupidly] trying to keep it secret from my wife.

I’m trying to figure out the story here.

She’s a lifeguard. He is supposed to drop her off at the pool on the ride into work, but he’s trying to get some gaming in and is telling her to take the bus?

or

He again forgot to pick up groceries on the way home from work, there’s no food in the house, she has no car/no job, he’s already too stoned to go back out for food and he won’t give her the car keys.

or

It’s Friday night. She had planned a nice sexy dinner picnic by the swimming pool for the two of them, and instead of changing into his swimsuit and joining her, he went straight to the video game and bong after work.

or

His kink is hanging around the house in a suit. (I can’t go on; that one’s too weird.)
- junker
  
  Well if it’s really based on the game the explanation is much less sexy: the woman is his sister, not girlfriend.
N__B

I am opposed to mistreating people because they are female. I am in favor of mistreating people because they wear Uggs.

To address bspen’s point, I think she can discern the seasons. I know people who wear Uggs 365 days a year.
- ChrisTS
  
  Yup. I have students wandering about in short shorts and Uggs. Don’t their feet sweat?
  - N__B
    
    If their legs are good thermal conductors, their feet will keep their asses warm and their asses will keep their feet cool.
- MikeJake
  
  Just your typical spring wardrobe.
- bspencer
  
  I know women wear Uggs in all seasons and I THINK IT’S BONKERS.
  - N__B
    
    I reserve “BONKERS” for the Cruggs wearers.
    - Gregor Sansa
      
      I just followed your link. And now I am getting ads for shoe lifts. Google ads are spooky for knowing that much about how I browse, and also for still being that wrong.
TribalistMeathead

How awful it must be to be Kerry Howley.
Shakezula

BONG HITS FOR RANDOM FLUCTUATIONS IN THE SPACE TIME CONTINUUM!
DrDick

Reason is proof that truth in advertising laws do not apply to magazines.
- That kid in the corner
  
  Snap!
R. Johnston

I think the argument that atheism, technically, has little to do with social causes–outside of making sure people remain free of religious burden–is sound.

It really, really isn’t a sound argument.

In order for organized atheism to make sense as a concept there has to be a reason why atheism matters. If all atheism is is a club membership that distinguishes its members from those in club Theist, then who gives a fuck? In that case organized atheism is no different or more sensible than organized Yankeefandom or organized EarlGraydrinkerdom. Fan clubs are not political movements.

Atheism matters because reality matters. The right to be an atheist matters because the right not to be forced to live a lie matters. And if you accept the idea that reality matters, it doesn’t just matter when it comes to atheism. It matters when it comes to whether or not women are inferior beings to men–they aren’t! It matters when it comes to whether or not harassment does real harm–it does! It matters when it comes to examining whether privilege is real, whether the privileged benefit from the context of history, and whether invidious discrimination still makes a huge difference in people’s lives–it is, they do, and it does! It matters when it comes to whether or not glibertarian economic reasoning should get them laughed out of police society–it should!

Atheism without social justice is just a bunch of people wearing the same funny hats.
- StampOutOolong
  
  Fan clubs are not political movements.
  
  Keep thinking that…
  - GreenTea4Evah
    
    Die, Oolongist scum.
    - wjts
      
      But as for me, I say, “Give me Yorkshire Gold or give me death!”
      - Gregor Sansa
        
        You shall not steep within the French press of labor this crown of thorns. You shall not crucify mankind on a cross of Yorkshire Gold!
- Uncle Ebeneezer
  
  Well said.
  
  Also Bspence, glad to see that Greta is on your radar. She is all kinds of awesome.
  - bspencer
    
    Yeah, and I’ve finally gotten around to bookmarking Ophelia Benson and Stephanie Svan, too.
- bspencer
  
  OK. Fair point.
- atheist
  
  Atheism without social justice is just a bunch of people wearing the same funny hats.
  
  And it’s boring. How many fuckin’ times can you explain why you don’t believe in God? After a while it gets really old.
- les
  
  Well said; but it’s worth remembering that there is a non-trivial number of folks who find the funny hat and think they are the only ones, even in these enlightened times. The mere existence of the club still has value.
  - Steve LaBonne
    
    But the returns are rapidly diminishing.
David W.

I think the argument that atheism, technically, has little to do with social causes–outside of making sure people remain free of religious burden–is sound. It’s just that I can’t think of a downside of taking them up anyway. It seems like a win-win proposition to me.

As a non-believer myself, I’d like to add that I’m happy to make common cause with believers on issues like same-sex marriage and immigration reform, and I don’t think atheists in general have a problem with doing so either.
- Steve LaBonne
  
  Never met one who did. Some of us are even happy enough to do it from within (quasi)-religious movements like Unitarian Universalism.
Manju

…some prominent members of the community think that taking up social causes will…drive out the [libertarians].

Would it? Couldn’t they just introduce issues that make liberals uncomfortable, like advocate for more free trade and off-shoring (benefits the word’s poor)?
- bspencer
  
  I suppose they could. My hunch is they’re going to be outnumbered. So if anyone’s gonna be driven out, it’ll be them.
  - Manju
    
    ah…plus, if the art hasn’t driven the liberals out by now, nothing will.
KmCO

The liber-bro-tarianism: it burns. It’s almost beautiful in its un-ironically unflattering portrayal of itself.
Col Bat Guano

Shouldn’t the Atheist social cause be education? Especially science education?
- Another Holocene Human
  
  Well it kind of says it all that the organization fighting creationism in schools is a separate, not explicitly atheist org, NCSE, which was led for years (and well) by Eugenie Scott.
Gregor Sansa

I spend a bit of time on Less Wrong, which is a “rationalist” website; pretty close to being “atheist”. I’ve met some of them in real life; in my experience, about 20% of them meet about 80% of the stereotype (ie, not actual raging misogynists, but still seriously unenlightened, as well as generally socially nerdy); about another 40% meet about 30% of the stereotype (despite being super-aware of cognitive bias, they have exactly the biases you’d expect, but still nice people); and about 40% are not at all what you’d expect.

The patron saint of that community is probably Eleizer Yudkowsky. Who happens to write excellent Harry Potter fanfic (seriously; I’m not being snarky about that one) and be a generally smart guy… but then, this last April Fools, he came out with a “joke” that is so incredibly sophomoric that, if I hadn’t already purged myself of all irrational feeling and become yea a veritable Omega in my objective wisdom, it would have made me unwilling to admit I’d ever heard of the guy.

I don’t know what the moral of all that is.
- Gregor Sansa
  
  Note that “sophomoric” in this case is still several steps up from the average Reason article. Is “freshmanic” a word?
- Ronan
  
  not what youd expect in a good or bad way?
  
  not what id expect here would be ‘religious nuts’?
  - Gregor Sansa
    
    In a good way. That is, basically nice, normal, people, only slightly less diverse in age, class, and nationality than the Cambridge norm.
- pedantic nerd
  
  Less Wrong is… yeah. I realized very quickly that there are two different ways of interpreting that phrase. There are people who genuinely want to be smarter and more rational, and there are people who want to feel like they are smarter and more rational than everybody else.
  
  They’re both a little nuts, but the latter are exactly as you might imagine, and at least in my local meetup group, the definite majority. It was almost as bad as that time I went to a “Serving Mankind” potluck…
  
  It’s similar to other experiences I’ve had with high IQ-type people. Some smart people are actually good at thinking, but a lot of them it’s like the 7 foot 3rd string center for a college basketball team, one of those painfully lumbering fuckers with hands that seem to be made of some combination of cement and astroglide. Just because you’re tall doesn’t mean you are going to be good at basketball.
The prophet Nostradumbass

There’s also a discussion of this magazine cover/article at Ars Technica.
joe from Lowell

So while the atheist debate whether or not they should help their fellow human beings, Pope Demands ‘Legitimate Redistribution’ of Wealth.

VATICAN CITY (AP) — Pope Francis is calling for governments to redistribute wealth to the poorest and for a new spirit of generosity to take hold.

You got the Reason side, and then you’ve got the other side. Theologically speaking, of course.
- carcin
  
  And what portion of the Church’s wealth is he committing to the cause?
  
  You’ve got your own frigging _city-state_. Lloyd Blankfein should be so lucky….
- Captain Blicero
  
  Broad sweeping generalization is broad. I’m not a member of any atheist organization. I just don’t believe in god and go about my life. I don’t care about the institution one belongs to, I care about the individual. I’ve done hundreds of hours of pro bono work, I volunteer for a youth theater group, I’ve coached a baseball team-I’ve done more community service than I can list with any degree of humility and I don’t believe in god. We’re not all caught up in who has the right comic answers or trying to score points for our team on the internet. Some of us just live and help others just fine.
  - Captain Blicero
    
    Er, that should be the right cosmic answers.
    - Lee Rudolph
      
      I prefer the s-less version.
Brutusettu

As sly and junker pointed out.

The woman is supposed to be his sister, definitely not his girlfriend.
Elsword Hack

Just want to say your article is as surprising.
The clarity in your post is just nice and i can
assume you are an expert on this subject.
Well with your permission allow me to grab your feed to keep up to date with forthcoming post.
Thanks a million and please keep up the rewarding work.

My webpage: Elsword Hack